Workshop: Faith United

Minor disclaimer, I am a more detail-oriented reader than most, so I tend to make a bigger deal out of small details that other readers might not notice. Keep in mind my opinions probably don't represent the average reader.

Story:

You picked a pretty good place to start; I had some basic information to follow along, but also many questions. It was a compelling beginning. Unfortunately, the information I gathered about the previous thread didn't really add up for me, and possibly due to that, I had several issues with Am'aleh's line of reasoning.

The fact that Breaker originally wrested the Thaynebinder from a pirate implies it was on the sea, or around a dock. While I don't know because I didn't read it, I wonder why Breaker would not simply ask Am'aleh about these doubts, if he can speak to her near water as he does in this post. It sounds like the plot of the previous thread hinged on a misunderstanding, which seems like the first thing an immortal being who can presumably oversee this person she sent on a very vital task would be careful to avoid.

Though you state what he did with her power later (stepping over an ocean), you didn't really elaborate on why exactly he did it. I can infer it was to settle his mind on whatever misunderstanding took place, but that particular misunderstanding is never fully explained. If it really was just that Am'aleh helped the treasure hunters find the thing, then I don't understand the logic that would lead one to think Am'aleh had betrayed them.

It also seems a bit odd Am'aleh is willing to allow someone who betrayed and bound her back into her service. I presume she doesn't want to waste such a seemingly devoted pawn, but the reasoning for Am'aleh's allowance of the previous misunderstanding, and willingness to forgive it, doesn't seem well laid out early on. If it is simply that she cares for Breaker enough to overlook these things, I don't think that was made clear enough.

Also, if she actually wants to stop Khal'jaren, limiting Breaker by removing his access to the Tap is literally counter-productive, as he points out. If she just wants to torment him with an endless task while keeping his hope alive, I could see all of her previous actions, but Khal'jaren is presumably an actual threat. If she's pragmatic enough to keep Breaker despite his betrayal, she wouldn't waste him in a time of need, and her being vindictive enough to torment him with hope would mean she doesn't consider Khal'jaren enough of a threat to use all of her resources. That seems odd considering he's an Elder Thayne, a title which I haven't seen used for Am'aleh. Either way I can't settle on a line of reasoning that explains everything.

I had several issues with the scene at the temple of Y'edda in post five as well. The priest happening to speak the perfect line for Josh to interrupt just as he's walking in the door feels a bit contrived, with no mention of him waiting patiently for a good time to interrupt. The whole scene plays out too smoothly for my liking, as well. Only two people yelled anything at this asshole who just wandered in talkin' smack? The priest is also surprisingly lenient to let Josh continue to speak after that entrance.

Josh bringing up the Faith United thing after boasting about his god was a definite non-sequitur. It's not as though they couldn't make their own militia, without this asshole. The tone also contradicts. For trying to create an inclusive group of all Thayne worshipers, he sure started off with the worst possible attitude for convincing people.

Not only that, the whole 'immovable' trick kinda falls apart for me when you mention that people know his reputation. Even if it's not magic he's known for, and even if people don't know his exact equipment, magic is a thing, and remaining immobile is pretty easy to accomplish with magic. It would be well within the realm of possibility for a guy as widely-known and likely well-off as Josh to be able to do something like that, or at least afford an item that could. I'm not saying all commoners would deduce that, but not a single one does, and they all just conveniently fall into place. The trick isn't clever enough for such a clean first victory to feel earned, in my opinion.

The 'ticking the temple off the list' line at the end of this post feels like a good description of the scene; technically fine, and even well written, but shallow and kinda contrived.

Credulity is stretched even further in the following post. You're telling me Josh, the known brawler and badass, converted churches by bending steel, something not unreasonable for a brawler/badass to do? How does that have anything to do with Am'aleh, or his Faith United thing? Even in our world strongmen bend steel.

I know it wasn't the point of the thread, but the whole converting churches thing is really blown over. We get one scene where everything goes perfectly, then a paragraph where everything else goes perfectly. The only conflict is literally just the line 'some resisted more than others.' For being such a daunting test of faith without his magic, he sure blew through it pretty quickly. I also note a distinct lack of any kind of political trouble for literally raising an army and marching it through various people's land.

It is at this point that Josh seems to completely forget his conversation with Am'aleh at the start of this thread, specifically his warning to her of Khal'jaren's intentions, and her orders to him in the following post. Several of these next points stem from that.

It seems out of place for a man so devoted to Am'aleh to design a banner with Khal'jaren at the center of it, the thayne who is literally plotting against them. When Am'aleh told him to convert his followers over to another god, and then showed her true form to him, that clearly implied she wanted them to convert to worshiping her, yet Josh's actions don't seem to match that. He's giving prominence to other gods on his flag, even those of the 'enemy,' and simply gathering an army, with no mention of converting them. The fact that Am'aleh later asks him to remove this symbol makes it seem even more ridiculous that he hadn't thought of that himself.

Wondering how the Thaynes could allow an atrocity to be commited against Faith United is kind of strange when it was literally created to battle one of the thaynes; the culprit being Khal'jaren's followers is the obvious conclusion. It seems doubly strange that Josh even had to ask Am'aleh why Khal'jaren was after Faith United, when he was literally the one who told Am'aleh of Khal'jaren's plot against them.

Even though you obviously took the time to mention the repercussions of the attack, grieving families and whatnot, nothing the reader has had any significant time with was lost. In the span of one paragraph, Faith United even grows stronger than ever before. Sort of makes the explosion both not mean a lot, and feel very convenient.

The conversation with Am'aleh following the bomb is especially redundant, given their conversation at the start of the thread. Am'aleh basically just showed up to tell Josh what he already should've known, repeat herself about converting Khal'jaren's followers, and then tell him to remove that symbol from the banner and replace it with her own, something he already should've done if he was following her original orders.

While I like Breaker's anger at his men not kneeling fast enough to Am'aleh, that scene also seemed a bit odd. She talks like she has her own sources, and has so far waited on Breaker to report to her, when she didn't know already, but now she comes ashore immediately to read this particular letter. I can't quite get a read on exactly the extent of her powers. In portraying Breaker's relationship with her, I think she may have been inadvertently humanized more than necessary. This feels like a very mundane thing for a thayne to bother doing, and kind of makes it impossible to play the 'gods work in mysterious ways' card later.

I'm torn on the almost-hanging scene. On the one hand, it establishes the mixed-bag that is Faith United, both how much it has swelled with Breaker not recognizing his own lieutenants, and how it's not as united as the name implies.

On the other hand, it seems very odd to me that they're apparently going to hang the guy immediately. They must've started before the letter even got to Breaker. No interrogation, not even one night detained before hanging in the morning, just immediately dragged to the noose.

It also seems strange that no one else nearby would stop them from immediately hanging that guy, and that the lieutenant in question claimed the commander had lost it, when he had to be well aware how sadistic his group looked, and that they were twisting his orders greatly. To not at least detain them for both that, and the desertion, is making it clear there are no consequences for breaking the rules in this already tenuous army. Feels like a kinda contrived excuse for good-guy Breaker to talk the talk, and then refuse to walk the disciplinary walk. Considering the deserters are literally the only revealed antagonists, I'm going to assume this will end up biting him in the ass. Also, why did Breaker just let the almost-hanged guy go? He is the only suspect for the second bomb; at least question him.

The reveal that Breaker had been possessed to give strange orders in his sleep finally caught my attention. There hadn't been any real conflict so far, so this was a welcome development. Unfortunately, this was never actually explained in a satisfactory manner. The following are my thoughts on the matter.

Firstly, the line 'my lady is testing me' after that reveal didn't make a lot of sense to me. Her 'test' was to make him give out a bunch of orders while he's unconscious, and make one of them to drown his lover if he contradicts any of these orders he doesn't know.

It is very convenient that one of the men thought to tell him this. Also makes me wonder who sent him the letter in the first place, if everyone thinks these were his orders. Why warn him his own orders are about to be followed, or if you're suspicious, why wait to ask him about it until a guy is about to be hanged? This plan seems designed to drown Josh's lover, without him having any knowledge of why it happened. Why would he assume Am'aleh would want to do such a thing? Also, despite saying it was a test by Am'aleh, he questions who possessed him in the next post, directly contradicting his own conclusion.

Up until this point, the logical conclusion was that Am'aleh was jealous of Kinley and wanted her dead. Someone else ordering Kinley to be drowned wouldn't work, since Am'aleh could just save her. I also don't really buy that the vision of Am'aleh saving Kinley was just from weariness. It would be odd, when he already suspects that this may be Am'aleh's doing, to hallucinate something as hopeful as her saving Kinley. That makes it more likely, in my opinion, the vision was done to him maliciously, since it literally stopped him from bothering to continue saving her, something only the person who possessed him would want to do.

The scene with Kinley nearly drowning causes two problems, as I see it. It sets up an expectation for answered questions by subverting the obvious answer to the possession puzzle, but those expectations are never met as that puzzle is never actually solved. I was finally genuinely interested with that subversion, but it never payed off and felt disappointing because of it.

The second problem, is that it basically proves that Am'aleh abandoned Josh. Kinley was literally drowning in the ocean, Am'aleh's domain, and yet Am'aleh did not actually save her. Either Am'aleh caused the illusion of Kinley being saved and thus actively tried to kill her, or just chose to let it happen despite it being in her domain. If she was somehow stopped by another Thayne, she could've easily told Josh that afterwards. This obviously clashes with the friendly terms on which Josh and Am'aleh converse at the end of the thread. Again, you've kinda spoiled your ability to use the 'gods work in mysterious ways' card to explain this one by showing how invested Am'aleh is in Breaker.

While the scene fighting the deserters was certainly fun to read, it also had some problems in my opinion. It's odd to see such loyalty from mercenaries as the deserters, to start. They're willing to risk death against a man they know isn't quite human all to carry out orders after they've been expunged from the army anyway. Breaker also doesn't even try to explain that he was possessed. Also, the fact that one of the deserters knows the value of his boots, to the point of saying whoever kills him gets to keep them, definitely calls into question how he convinced anyone in those churches.

While I enjoyed Kinley utilizing Josh's advice and going for the eyes, the last few mercenaries died in a pretty disappointing, unceremonious way. This final confrontation in general feels a bit rushed, especially since it's the only conflict in this thread that actually resolves.

You conveyed the confusion of Breaker very well after reviving Kinley, but that whole tone, that was so well-set by subversion, just disappears after that. Josh knowing everything would be fine after the deserter fight kills it. To tell Kinley that is one thing, but to actually say he knew it would be fine with his very faith and sanity in question is a very contradicting tone, especially after lines like him wondering what happened to his world a few posts back. This felt like a cheap 'happy ending' sticker slapped onto an unfinished thread.

The conclusion also doesn't make much sense to me. Him using his own likeness as the center of the flag, instead of Am'aleh's as he was commanded, has the strong implication that he is breaking away from her, abandoning his faith, or at least saying his faith in himself is equal or greater than his faith in her. Either Am'aleh was responsible for Kinley almost drowning, and should be stricken from the flag, or Am'aleh should be angry that Breaker is disobeying her orders.

The major conflict, the possession and the question of who tried to have Kinley killed, were not resolved in this thread. Not only that, Breaker remains on good terms with Am'aleh despite the fact that she has not expunged herself of suspicion in the possession incident, and despite the fact that he has not only bound her against her will, and disobeyed her orders, he even usurped her place as the center of worship for Faith United.

The last line sounds nice, and the last scene looks cool, but I can't enjoy it over all of the narrative dissonance. This has the feel of a project that stopped and started several times in its life. I would recommend keeping notes for cases like that. That covers the majority of the problems I had with this thread. Otherwise, it was as well written as usual. Hopefully some of the following feedback with be useful.

Setting:

In general, I think you handled setting well in this thread. None of the actual settings were very memorable, but the description was good. This was in first person though, so description isn't as necessary, in my opinion. You sprinkled enough details about Breaker throughout the first post to give me an idea of his appearance. Though descriptions of him other than the bracer fused to his arm thin out afterwards, you revisit them occasionally.

You waited until the second post to become more descriptive, which I think was a good call. The high pacing of the first post added to the effectiveness of the hook. The description in the second post was also very good, and felt well balanced with the pacing. The final line for post two was nicely vivid, as well.

I think most of the rest of the thread was well balanced, but in general there was less description in the second half than in the first. There were several memorable lines that I liked quite a bit; I noted them in the technique section. I'd say you did well in this category, especially for first person, but picking more interesting settings couldn't hurt.

Pacing:

As usual, your pacing at the post and paragraph level is excellent. The small paragraph sizes and majority of dialogue in the first post kept pacing high, which is a pretty good thing at the beginning, I think. I was moving on to the second post before I realized it.

Your formatting during dialogue is also on-point, in particular the thinning of prose just before Kinley's "Why" in post four. Using the pacing to accentuate certain parts of the conversation seems pretty effective. The pacing of post five was well balanced as well, easing into the quicker dialogue, and slowing back down near the end. Every time I read one of your threads, I gain more of an appreciation for how well you handle this category.

That said, there were a few scenes that were unnecessary, in my opinion. This is more about editing, but this seemed the best category to collect these notes into:

While I do like the lore addition of Am'aleh's true form in post three, I'm not entirely sure what purpose it served. There was no mention of this image changing Breaker's mind in any way, she just transforms real quick for some reason.

The pacing was well done, with enough detail, but the premise of the conversation with Am'aleh after the explosion at camp, and the redundancy of the information she revealed, also makes me think that scene was unnecessary.

Even though I enjoyed it, we didn't really gain any important information from the scene where Breaker offers gold to any of his men who can land a blow, either. It's kinda tropey, and only establishes Josh's strength, which was already established when he withstood Am'aleh's punishment at the start of the thread. There weren't any tie-ins to the fight later, either.

Communication:

I noted no problems with this category I haven't mentioned elsewhere. The dialogue between Josh and Kinley was good, as well as with Am'aleh. I enjoyed the repetition of her 'I am the ocean' line as well. The dialogue with the Y'edda priest, and in the almost-hanging scene, were both kind of off, but that was for motivation and logic-related reasons; the writing itself was fine. I'd say the bolding of the last line in post twelve was a good formatting choice. Didn't really notice much else, so considering this thread was like half-dialogue, I'd say you handled this category well.

Action:

Though there wasn't a lot of action in this thread, it was excellently done. The fight between Josh and his men was quite enjoyable. It was well described and paced, and helped sell the later line about feeling almost human. Not sure if half a post was worth making that one point, considering the scene doesn't accomplish much else, but it was eye-candy if nothing else.

The fight against the deserters in post thirteen was also very fun to read. I think you balance metaphor with literal description very well, and clarity is also excellent. There were two points in this fight that didn't quite work for me, though.

The whole 'four elements coming from cardinal directions' thing felt kinda contrived, but the mental image was cool; except the wind part. 'Buffeting' isn't exactly the most fearsome of verbs.

The 'shattered with furious strength' line from post fourteen fell flat for me as well. You sold the danger well enough, but you didn't sell the struggle, and then a twenty percent decrease is enough to go from apparently completely bound, to just bustin' out of that shit no problem. That whole fight really wrapped up too quickly, but that could just be because I wanted to read more of it.

Persona:

For the most part, this category was well done; the first scene with Kinley, for example. We didn't learn much about her specifically this thread, but seeing their relationship was enough to create some investment, I think. Considering the thread started with a somewhat intense high-pace scene, I think it was a good call to slow things down for a moment and give the reader some time with the mundane, as well. While it didn't accomplish much story-wise, the misunderstanding concerning the Thaynebinder was humorous, and more time with Kinley helped reader investment, I think.

Breaker was a bit less consistent. He comes off as quite the dick in the fifth post, and rather boastful. Claiming he will be the leader among Am'aleh's followers to a group of people who follow a different god is kind of tertiary bragging. Josh questioning if Am'aleh was even real after Kinley almost drowned also felt a bit off. He's literally been fused with her and used her powers. I also don't understand his motivation. I thought it was to serve Am'aleh, but he's disobeyed her orders plenty in this thread. The line from post eight about how almost breaking a sweat felt human was good, though. It helped to get across the mental change he's undergone in attaining his form. I would've liked to have seen more of this.

There was also the exhaustion thing that you kept bringing up. Mentioning that he feels exhausted does little to sell it. There have to be consequences, or at least corroborating details. He hasn't made any mistakes because of it, he hasn't overreacted or changed his responses to show the strain; he doesn't even show any physical signs, like baggy eyes. I thought we were actually getting that with the possession reveal, when he didn't remember giving those orders, but that turned out to be something else. If that whole thing really was exhaustion, you were definitely being too subtle about it. In post nine for instance, you mentioned him allowing himself too much sleep of late, and then talk about sleep deprivation a few paragraphs later. I expect the prior comment was meant to show his dedication, and feeling that he should've been even more vigilant, and the contradictory wording was unintentional, but if that was meant as a hint his nights were being spent without his knowledge, it was far too subtle.

Mechanics:

Nearly flawless; only two (debatable) fragments, and one typo.

Quote:

"Alive." - Post Two, Eighth Paragraph - My favorite nit-pick. Could've worked just as well with a semi-colon, or as a thought.

"Yet." - Post Seven, Fifth Paragraph. - Same as above.

â€œI do not break. am the Breaker!â€ - Post Fourteen, Paragraph Five. - Man, what an inopportune place for a typo. It's a pretty cool line, otherwise.

Clarity:

While your wording was always clear, I did find a few things that didn't quite make sense logically. There was only one consistent one, though. I was confused at the 'hiding the Thaynebinder' scene in post four. I had assumed the section fused with his arm was connected to the rest by something, wire or chain, by the way it was described to remain together earlier, with no mention of the pieces separating. This was made stranger by Kinley not even noticing the bracer, or mentioning it. He wasn't described as having it when he left the night before. The description of the 'chains' on the Thaynebinder in post six reignited my confusion about the bracer fused to his arm, and by what means it is attached to the rest of the artifact. Also, this is the second scene with Kinley where Josh is wearing the bracer, that I can only assume she's never seen before, and there's been no mention made of it.

Other than that, I only noticed a few oddities:

'Cut him down' is strange wording to use when you just described a bunch of guys pulling on the other end of the rope to hang the guy.

The 'it took too long' line after retrieving Kinley seemed out of place, since you described diving and returning all in one sentence. The pacing contradicted the line a bit.

While I get it now, the 'molten ice' from post twelve threw me off at first, since that would be, you know, water.

How exactly does one hand both grip and spread two arms, giant or no?

Why does he need to confirm the authenticity of the Thaynebinder? It has literally already bound a Thayne and lived up to its name.

Technique:

In terms of technique, I think you exhibited a bit more flair than I've seen in your other threads. Your word choice especially seems to have gotten more vivid, both in verbs and metaphors. I like the direction your style took in this thread, and you do first person very well. Glad to see some experimentation. Don't have much to suggest other than keep it up. I'll leave you with a few lines I particularly enjoyed:

That 'world ground to a halt' paragraph in the first post was very good.

The 'giant hand scooping earth' description from post seven was definitely memorable.

I really liked the razor-winged butterfly metaphor from post eleven; excellent imagery.

That covers all of my thoughts on this thread. I hope I didn't come off too harshly in the story category; I've always been one to get hung up on the details. Despite that, this thread was still enjoyable. The interactions were interesting, the fights were awesome, and there were some good lines. Always entertaining with a thayne involved. Feel free to hit me up if you have any questions.