Writer's Workshop

[Zook Murnig]

Something was brought up in the thread about judging time that I thought was a particularly good idea: Having a separate Writer's Workshop that you can opt to submit your thread to whenever you submit it for judging. There, the request would be public and anyone could give critiques and advice on improving the writing, or how the story could have been better.

Either it would take another hack into the Report A Post system, or a member of the thread could simply make a thread in the appropriate place and link to the quest or battle.

I'd like to see what kind of support this could get before I think about bringing it up on the mod forum. I'd also like to hear about not only who would submit their thread to it, but who would be interested in using this as a way to offer criticism and help other writers. Obviously it would take time and effort to read the threads that get submitted, and any rubric-based judgments posted there would be unofficial, but it's a good way, I think, to get some feedback from the member base at large on your writing.

[Edward Judorne]

I like it. I'd judge in my spare time, those particularly good non-mod judges that judged frequently enough could be asked to join the judging team, the whiners would get second opinions and maybe realize that they really do need to improve (Please don't bring the whining discussion in here because I said this), It would certainly solve a lot of problems. Heck, The more judges we have, the less time it might take to judge a thread. I see no downside, at the moment.

[Rayse Valentino]

Would be a nice way to garner public support for JC nominations. *whistles*

[Zook Murnig]

There is a downside that was brought up with me after I had made this thread. And that is that a judge could give someone a score, then a group of nonmods could read the thread and give a completely different score, effectively bringing the official judgment into question. We want our judges to feel safe in their decisions, so if this is implemented, please do not take the numeric score of a regular member over that of a mod who has been approved for such a duty.

[Edward Judorne]

I suppose that is a downside, but then there will also be times where it is the opposite. So if that ever happens, the judges can bring the opposite scenario into question too. It would all even out.

Plus the fact that the people judging your threads are not the official judges and therefore could easily be missing a lot of stuff.

[Call me J]

There is a downside that was brought up with me after I had made this thread. And that is that a judge could give someone a score, then a group of nonmods could read the thread and give a completely different score, effectively bringing the official judgment into question. We want our judges to feel safe in their decisions, so if this is implemented, please do not take the numeric score of a regular member over that of a mod who has been approved for such a duty.

Inexperienced members are going to be more likely to be erratic with scores, but I bet that the covariance between the moderator scores and experienced member scores wouldn't be that high. Honestly, I wouldn't feel any less safe in the scores I gave out as a result of this. With all due respect, if a member who has never been on staff gave a score 20 points higher than me, I feel that my experience in judging threads speaks much higher for my credibility.

My bigger question would be this, how many of you would use this Writer's Workshop, both to get critiques and critique.

[SnootchyBootchykins]

What's to stop anyone from making a thread in the RPC, linking a thread and asking for critiques? Many writers over the years have done more or less just that.

[Edward Judorne]

I suppose you could do that, but It would make life easier if there was a specific forum to do so in.

[Zook Murnig]

Truth be told, I've made several threads of my own in the RPC for critiques of my quests. They all died rather quickly due to the level of activity there. Threads like that, and recruitment threads, get buried in a matter of days. I'm guessing that's why when I came back in September, there was a subforum of the RPC for recruitment.

If we had a similar subforum for the Writer's Workshop, then people's threads wouldn't get buried and members could find them quickly and easily.

As for usage, I would definitely submit most of my quests and battles to this, and I would probably do some critique on the threads of others. Not full scoring, as I wouldn't want to step on another moderator's toes, but suggestions for improvement.

[Max Dirks]

Player's don't necessarily have to give scores. They can merely provide the commentary to fill in the gaps.

[Doomsday]

I really never liked the rate me threads and really don't think they need their own forum. Either the threads get Ego booster replies or they just say the same things as past judgments. They're really never very helpful since most players half ass them and really a writers workshop should be more proactive, maybe have a matchmaking service for people that want to help each other as they quest. A writers workshop has to be a bit more than little mini judgements for it to have any positive effect on Althanas' writing.

[Bloodrose]

I suppose I would probably submit material to be scanned over and picked at by the general populace, but I don't know just how much I would use it. Generally, if I've just completed a thread and want to know if there are any areas where I can improve, I simply ask whichever moderator takes the quest to include some commentary. I always thought that's why the additional comments box in the Submit Thread thing was there...

The moderator comments then tend to be fairly useful as well, because they've just spent a good deal of time pouring over the thread - and if they've read some of your stuff before - they can help identify problem areas in your writing.

Whether or not I would continue to use a Writer's Workshop, should one exist, would depend entirely on how useful comments made there are as compared to normal moderator comments. If it's all just a big happy ego-fest with lots of "Aww, I love your character!!1!", then I probably wouldn't continue with it.

Aww, I love my character too, but I don't care if you like him or not. I want you to tell me I suck, point out my flaws, and let me get to fixing them!

[Karuka]

I don't think I'd use it either way around. I'm at a stage in my writing where I know what my problems are, know that I'm probably going to make them even as I fight to fix them, etc.

Also, I don't believe that that many people would take the time to read other people's threads and give insightful critique. Many of us would rather work on our own stuff. I know that before I became a judge, I'd see the "rate me" threads, look at the thread, and if it was more than 8 or so posts already, I would leave it and go do something different. I had and have a lot of threads on my plate.

But that's just me.

[Ashiakin]

I'd probably never submit anything myself, but I think I'd offer advice to newer players on occasion. I doubt I'd help anyone with a year or more of experience. I don't see a forum like this as necessary but if a lot of players want it and would commit to using it, I would be fine with having it.


Player's don't necessarily have to give scores. They can merely provide the commentary to fill in the gaps.

Yeah, I'd prefer that players focused more on commentary and advice rather than giving out numerical scores. Judges give out scores in order to determine EXP and GP, really. There'd be no point in players giving out scores if the purpose of the forum is to provide constructive criticism and advice.

[AdventWings]

This is what I live for, definitely.

Provided I can find enough time to read, anyways... *Cries as he cradles his Shakugan no Shana light novel that isn't getting any justice*