Bandits > Rangers > Imperials

[Knave]

Ye! the Knave so came upon board. He came bearing news of such a battle as had only been seen by a few, and thus he brought himself great ecstasy in bringing that spectacle to others. Literary confection he suspected, in his foolish, knavish mind, and though confident of taste untasted, and a mass unjudged, he laid his hand upon the Writer’s Workshop. What followed was a clatter of religious and mystic clacks and intonations as the night burbled from his lips and the morning shone through his eyes.

When next he spoke, it was with a passion, “EXPERIENCE FOR THE EXPERIENCE GOD! LOOT FOR THE LOOT THRONE! EXPERIENCE FOR THE EXPERIENCE GOD! LOOT FOR THE LOOT THRONE!” When that was said, he followed with much less passion with, “Alright, boys and girls, a new workshop sits at the forefront of the WW, and before your eyes and fingers is a work requesting your attention; let them dance. There is a proper bounty for a proper job, and thanks shall fall upon all of you who review and write in earnest.

I, Knave! will formally judge this thread (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?22659-Bandits-gt-Rangers-gt-Imperials-OPEN) when I am informed by either good Yari or fish-tongued Ganlon that they have received their joyous due! Let constructive criticism bring the sky crashing down upon them!”

[Yari Rafanas]

In case anybody was confused by the above post, this is your chance to judge a judge and tell him he sucks. Well, try to be constructive in it, at least.

[/shameless bump]

[Sheex]

You suck. If I hadn't of done that, I'd be kicking myself until the end of the world. Though, funny story, I actually read your quest with every intention of critiquing it, but then got distracted with a certain game involving airships, espers, and nethecite. Pop quiz hotshots! What game am I talking about? Stew on that whilst I give you my humble opinion of this quest!

...Starting with the opening comment. Not of the actual quest (or battle, whatever you prefer), but of Knave's comment up there. Excuse me, but why the hell is it Good Yari and Fish-Tongued Ganlon? Damn judges...clinging together like that... me thinks it's time to rebel against authority!

Let me just say that I enjoyed the battle of He Who Does Not Shower Yari (hereafter to be referred to as Smelly) versus Hygienically Competent Ganlon (hereafter to be referred to as, er, Ganlon). I feel that, character wise, you both did very well illustrating the differences between one another. Where as Smelly is overconfident and dramatic, Ganlon is far more quiet and unassuming; I loved how Smelly pointed out his own character's faults, and ignored his hypocrisies (I really did think that Ganlon scored a point with that speech about just what a king is). Beautiful. Another thing I liked was that Ganlon constantly referenced other people who gave him advice (or as pleas for help); Smelly was quite a bit more self-centered. Loved it. Really well done there, you were both very unique in your writing styles. I really can't say more about character than that, maybe someone else can. I liked 'em both.

Though, I guess I should say that I found Smelly's little end speech about "The People Must Remember" a bit over the top for my taste. Not saying you're wrong, not saying it was bad. Just saying that, for me, the cocky thief suddenly creating a tear-jerking requiem (for some people anyhow) for the departed left a sour taste with me. I suppose it's because you spent the entire thread going from "look at me and my stylishly cool powers" to suddenly a "remember the fallen" theme a bit unrealistic. Though, again, it is just my opinion.

Moving away from character, as well as corny nicknames, just a quick stop on technical aspect. I really can't say anything bad about Yari here, but two things for Ganlon. One, when it comes to capitalizing, I noticed you capitalized king, along with other things that need not be capitalized. They could easily be just slip-ups or mistakes, but I'd like to say just a bit about king and when it should be capitalized.


King of Thieves

Yari capitalizes king when he overly dramatically gives his title, because it is that; a title. Even if he wasn't being overly dramatic, he would still capitalize it. You, however, wrote this:


If you are a King, my lord, then I am your servant. I am willing as Underwood’s representative to see if your title of King is earned or divine.”

King in and of itself need not be capitalized. When referencing a specific king (King Louis) or as a title (Yari was a very cocky King Of Thieves). For the above, it's fine to say "If you are a king."

Secondly, might be just me, but I hated this:


A ball of multi-colored light erupted that filled the air with a prism of ROY G BIV and moved from the spear head towards Ganlon.

Not the sentence itself, but rather that ROY G BIV part. I assume you were describing the colors of the prism, but for me, having this part quite literally jarred me out of what was otherwise a pretty smooth flowing story. I get you were going for description, but I would have rather seen...description than that. This part would have been so much better if you had described Yari's beautiful (and wonderfully dramatic) death beam than...just that.

Decent death though. Would have liked a little more info on Genove, seeing as how she's your true love. Nothing much; hair color, eye color, a fleeting memory, a wishful thought. Just a little bit of detail would have been nice. Dare I even say tear-jerking?

Er, no, I won't as you didn't die. I mean, I get why you didn't, would kinda suck to kill off a character in such a manner; I certainly wouldn't off any of mine like that. Not the actual death, but the whole dying in a quick battle. Gotta put some thought into such things.

Still...still if I had one complaint for this thread, which I really did enjoy, it would have been the conclusion. I'm okay with Ganlon's "death" being fairly short, though as I said, more detail would have been nice. I'm cool with how he died, totally out-gunned and thinking of his love; that's great. It was just, you went to "make an example out of him" only to find out that no example was really made, cause he didn't really die. Aside from personal opinions on that requiem part (and I will say that my dislike of Yari there was solely based on my personal likes and dislikes), the whole end of nothing really happened kinda bugged me. It was as if I could literally see everyone there, from warrior to little kid sitting on his dad's shoulders, shrug all at once. Possibly with a statement of "Eh? That's the end? Well, how's them chickens Bill?" Though, I did like Yari's comment at the end towards the... shall I say Deus Ex Machina of the monks? Made me smile.

That's all I really got. Like I said, a good, quick read from my point of view. The things I suggested, well, they're just my thoughts, no need to take 'em seriously if you don't want to. All in all, a nice read.

Oh, and Ganlon? The seven P's? Frigging hilarious. Loved it.

Now then, did you figure out the game I was playing? It was Final Fantasy XII. I was feeling a bit old school, so I gave it a shot. Not a fan of it as a kid, but I like it now. Though, it could be because I thought Final Fantasy XIII was crap. What does this have to do with anything? Why, nothing at all. Cheers!

[Yari Rafanas]

Your feedback is great, Sheex. I've got a lot of work ahead of me for my "remember me" threads. Oh, I also guessed the game before reading through. Great choice.

[Les Misérables]

Will edit commentary in later... just reminding myself with this.

[Ganlon Martel]

Thanks for the time you took to read and post on my thread Sheex. I always seem to have that probelm with CAPITALS, and yes I guess I took the easy way out with the ROY G BIV thing.

[Hauntologist]

some stuff:

"It seemed"

Are you sure? Was it or was it not? Rarely in narration do things 'seem', unless there is intentional misrepresentation going on. Otherwise they are useless filler words that do nothing for the meaning and quite often can have the effect of making it seem less strong as well as confusing the reader. Later on you even use both "it seemed" and "a bit" in a sentence. If they are undecided then just let them be undecided, they don't have to seem undecided and nor do they only have to be "a bit" undecided. They could be indecisive as well, if you want to show that they may be leaning in different directions.

I'm noticing a lot of problems with telling instead of showing in your writing. You are telling people about situations instead of showing them that those situations are the reality. I think that if you followed the rule: "show, don't tell" that would fix your problem with using seemed all the time and make your writing way more interesting and engaging instead of bland.

For some examples of this, "And no, the thief would not play fair": don't tell us that, write that your character does something that is obviously underhanded.

"Their taunting and conversation had come to an halt, replaced by the hissing sparks and loud reverberation of heavy metal on metal." Instead, show the reader the hissing sparks and reverberation of metal on metal with imagery, don't just tell them its happening.

There are some word choice issues here and there - like using "idea" instead of "threat" of attack. The verb "diced" does not mean 'play dice' it means 'chop finely', so that sentence makes very little sense.

There is also this use of "obviously broad" in a description. Again, this is the narrator, so adjectives like obviously serve the same function as the verb "seemed" and can generally be omitted as they do nothing but take up space. With that being said, Ganlon's posts are more fun to read because they follow pretty well the "show, don't tell" rule.

"Scooped up" doesn't mean what you think it means.

"confused to" should be "confused about"

There is at least one example of breaking past tense and using present instead, which is a no-no.

[Yari Rafanas]

some stuff:

"It seemed"

Are you sure? Was it or was it not? Rarely in narration do things 'seem', unless there is intentional misrepresentation going on. Otherwise they are useless filler words that do nothing for the meaning and quite often can have the effect of making it seem less strong as well as confusing the reader. Later on you even use both "it seemed" and "a bit" in a sentence. If they are undecided then just let them be undecided, they don't have to seem undecided and nor do they only have to be "a bit" undecided. They could be indecisive as well, if you want to show that they may be leaning in different directions.

I'm noticing a lot of problems with telling instead of showing in your writing. You are telling people about situations instead of showing them that those situations are the reality. I think that if you followed the rule: "show, don't tell" that would fix your problem with using seemed all the time and make your writing way more interesting and engaging instead of bland.

For some examples of this, "And no, the thief would not play fair": don't tell us that, write that your character does something that is obviously underhanded.

"Their taunting and conversation had come to an halt, replaced by the hissing sparks and loud reverberation of heavy metal on metal." Instead, show the reader the hissing sparks and reverberation of metal on metal with imagery, don't just tell them its happening.

There are some word choice issues here and there - like using "idea" instead of "threat" of attack. The verb "diced" does not mean 'play dice' it means 'chop finely', so that sentence makes very little sense.

There is also this use of "obviously broad" in a description. Again, this is the narrator, so adjectives like obviously serve the same function as the verb "seemed" and can generally be omitted as they do nothing but take up space. With that being said, Ganlon's posts are more fun to read because they follow pretty well the "show, don't tell" rule.

"Scooped up" doesn't mean what you think it means.

"confused to" should be "confused about"

There is at least one example of breaking past tense and using present instead, which is a no-no.

Cool breakdown, but did you enjoy any of it?

Also, I am fine with this amount of feedback if Ganlon is as well. Oh, wait, I guess numbers still has to post his thoughts up there.

[Hauntologist]

Of course I did, I wouldn't have written a critique if I didn't have fun reading it :). I learned about Underwood and such. The battle paced well and demonstrated creativity.

[Ganlon Martel]

I am happy with everything that has been posted and eagerly await full description of my fish mouth. Am I a catfish or a trout? But I also await the input of numbers.

[Les Misérables]

I've skimmed the entire thread but I think doing a one post analysis for each of you might help just as much. If I'm wrong please let me know, otherwise this may become a habit for writer's workshops. This is the kind of detail I always want to go into in judgments but often cant for one reason or another. It may be stuff you don't even think of normally, but if you can learn to make some of it a part of your game, it could open a lot of doors. Keep in mind I'm not saying that any or all of these changes should have been made, I'm essentially just finding places in your posts to give generic instruction on strong prose.


Their taunting and conversation had come to an halt, replaced by the hissing sparks and loud reverberation of heavy metal on metal. There was a roar of laughter and cheering that punctuated the attack, causing the bandit to briefly ponder just how much the Watchmen valued their soldier friend.
"An halt" might be a mechanical error, but what I want to draw your attention to here is sentence constructions. Overall this is a good opening to your post - it revisits what just happened and flows into the next action well. However this could grab the reader much more effectively with a few tweaks.

While this is debatable, I think it'd serve your purpose better to start with the main action (hissing sparks and reverberation of metal on metal) and then say what it interrupted. Also, you could lighten up that initial sentence by removing the words *loud and heavy*. My writing prof called these kinds of words phony intensifiers, and that is a great way of describing them.

Using great word combinations like "hissing sparks" and "reverberation of metal on metal" insinuates the fact that the noises are loud and heavy. By not using these words, you can highlight your excellent writing more while cutting down your word count, which in this case is definitely a good thing. After that I love your Watchmen allusion and the way you use a few simple sentences to summarise the crowd, the guards, and Yari's opinion of them, but this could be a little better too. Instead of saying "There was a roar of laughter and cheering", start the sentence with the subject, ie the doer of the main action. In this case it's the crowd. Saying "The onlookers roared and cheered" automatically gives a better mental image than "there was a..." think of it this way. any time you start a sentence that way, the first three words are about nothing :P


Yari absently withdrew his weapon to a defensive stance and shared a quick glance towards the crowd, scanning their faces and dress to see if anybody more important had shown up. He half wished to see an official from Underwood who knew his name, or maybe even that Red Marshal who was some sort of behemoth man wielding a gunblade, but nobody stood out. Just a bunch of up and coming warriors or mercs looking to learn from the best and have their green skills mocked or exploited in the arena.

Great paragraph... all I can say is you didn't need the words "who was" between Red Marshal and some sort.


Doesn't sound too different from my Pagoda days. Hmm, I wonder if Dirks is up to his old tricks again...

Overconfident as always, Yari forgot that one of these men was right before him, barreling or - was he falling? - at his lower section with the weight of his body behind an attack from his shield. The edge of the shield came down hard before the distracted King of Thieves had a moment to react. The armored foot of the thief absorbed as much of the dehlar edge as it could, but his leather and vlince could only do so much. Yari felt his right big toe snap under the blunt force, and his smirk quickly faded.

You need to be careful when snapping between character reverie and action, and you actually did a good job, but overdid it a little. Saying "the weight of his body behind an attack from his shield" tends to take me out of the moment. By just removing "an attack" that sentence becomes a solid visual of the attack, rather than a visual of some dude rolling a D12 for hit ratio on his shield attack. I like the way you get in to what's going on (description of vlince/leather) but this is a place where you could have shown rather than told. What exactly did it feel, look, or sound like as the different fibres of his boots parted? Also "quickly faded" is a weak ending to an otherwise strong paragraph, a sweet bit of personification, hyperbole, or other metaphor could have fit well there.



As Yari continued to limp backwards, snarl ever present, he threw his left hand dramatically to the side. His dirty, tattered cloak showed half its span and flared out as a myriad of bright, swirling lights crawled from the shadows of his armor and into the thief's opened hand. As Yari closed his fist around the dancing colors, they solidified into a sharp, angular knife, cut in a V shape. He wasted no time in tossing the magic edge overhand, straight towards the soldier's chest.

Just another quick organisation touch up on the first sentence of this paragraph... you can say "Yari limped backwards" instead of "Yari continued to limp" (the reader can assume he was already limping). Another option when you're continuing a previous action (such as "snarl ever present") would be a piece of imagery. Something as simple as "snarl still decorating his face" or "face still a snarling mask" would build on what you established previously rather than keeping it static. Notice that I'm using "snarl" as a verb rather than an adjective here - this keeps the action present, which makes for an exciting and continuous battle. Verbs are King.


Ganlon smiled just a little bit inside as he watched Yari jump back and could see a little of the pain on his face. Ganlon heard something that he had made him start to understand why soldiers did this, the roar of the crowd. He allowed his vision to move from Yari to the crowd who were now hooting and jeering.

What you'd want to do here is take every bit of this paragraph that is non-specific and either replace or get rid of it. Saying "a little bit" gives the reader's imagination almost nothing to work with. Instead, stick with specific physical manifestations. How does Ganlon's posture respond to him smiling on the inside? How does Yari's facial expression change when he feels pain? These are things that would connect me to the action rather than simply informing of its existence.

To briefly enter some specific battle tactics, at this point you also repeated dull, generic noises (the crowd sounds) that Yari already represented. This will never win you a battle - your only hope at beating the King of Thieves in a locale he feels confident in would be to find a special/surprising/unique way of tying the crowd responses to your storyline. If you go specific everywhere he goes generic, you may outwork him in the judge's eyes.


He looked up just in time to see the knife coming at his chest. He turned his waist and brought his sword up in attempt to block the weapon out of the air. The steel of the sword met the steel of magic and the V shaped knife bounced just a little off course. The colors of the magic were beautiful in Ganlon's sight and he could see the tendrils of light that bound them to Yari's hand.

This paragraph is pretty good, though it seems strange that Ganlon took his eyes off Yari for even a second. Other than that, try to avoid repeating words like "magic" two sentences in a row.


In the next instant he forgot about the beauty of the light as the magic ripped through his chain main shirt and buried itself into his right shoulder. His sword fell to the ground with a small spiral of dust. He could feel the pain in an instant. It was like the time he had tried to lift up the anvil on the farm with just his arms. Something in his shoulder no longer worked. It was a like a small sun had started new fusion his shoulder and he cried out in pain.
I think you could have just said "he forgot about the beauty of the light as it ripped through" - we know the light is the magic, and when you use the word magic so often everything seems much less... magical. Also you don't need "It was" before "Like the time he had tried..." - and the same applies later on.


Mother was the word that escaped his lips. Then Ganlon turned and ran. He ran around the podium to the opposite side and sat on the ground. He knew how bad the pain was so he thought he knew how bad the wound must be. Then he looked at it. He knew shock had set in and he felt himself get off center. The world felt like he was an ice cube bobbing in a cold drink. The wound was still bleeding when he looked at it and there as a hole big enough to place his pipe’s head into. He wondered if he would be able to use that hand again. Great character work, but careful with terms like "ice cube"... I dunno how commonplace those are in Corone.


He reached for the doorway in his mind to heal the wound and found a wall there. It was as if a cloud had passed over the inside of his head. He just couldn't find his way through the cloud of fog. He tried to look harder at it and could see the light of magic winding its way over the podium back to Yari. Yari had closed the door in his mind. Ganlon felt fear on top of his shock. He would have to find something to stay alive.
Consider substituting "it felt like" for "it was like" on occasion. Generally I think some stronger editing and the occasional use of a thesaurus could improve your prose overall.


He stood and ran again to where the wagon was with all of the left overs of the day. He tired to grab a shirt with his right hand and found that his hand no longer worked. He dropped his shield and with his left hand grabbed a piece of cloth and pushed it into the wound.

Ganlon was sure Yari would be upon him soon. He looked around and found the first thing that he could find. A broad sword hung from the wall nearest to Ganlon and he grabbed for it. Father, had taught him to fight with both hands; although, Ganlon had never practiced the way he should. Ganlon knew that he stood on the precipice of defeat and so ran one more time to stand near the water barrels. What ever happened next maybe he could find away to hold on a little longer from here.

You really need to be careful with grammar and punctuation. Especially in high intensity places like this. Unnecessary semi colons and commas are unfortunate in regular prose, but they can be particularly disruptive in action sequences such as althanas battles.


Yari might have gotten a bit more focus cuz I got tired... so Ganlon, let me know if you want anymore help. You can probably both pick up tips from each others critiques though, and my apologies if I sound harsh or made any jokes that weren't funny.

[Yari Rafanas]

Probably the first time I've ever had just one post broken down for me, Numbers. Thanks.

[Ganlon Martel]

This was great. Thank you for the time you put in on it. I will be making use of the things that you have given me in the future.

[Ganlon Martel]

If Yari is ready I happily await judgement by Knave.

[Yari Rafanas]

Word, we're good.

[Knave]

A judgement will be forthcoming, amen.