Well Althanas, what do you want?

[Amber Eyes]

This is the place to throw out your ideas for Althanas. What improvements can we make? What would you like to see in the near future? Should we fire Sei? :P

[Silence Sei]

Definately that last one. Sei's a douche.

[Zook Murnig]

Should we fire Sei?

Was there ever any doubt?

[Jasmine]

Yeah, but he's not as bad as some others that could be named. I say keep Sei.

[SirArtemis]

What about something like a Mini-archive for people? A specific section on their profiles that is similar to their character profile that acts as an archive that they can mage in their own way and on a timeline? I know people have their posts listed by default by a forum, but maybe something like what's in my signature but on a larger scale?

Then again, maybe I'll just add it to the end of my character profile..

[Duffy]

Tournament plox!

[Slayer of the Rot]

Tournament, fire Sei, send pics of your jugs to me, Amber Eyes.

[Venessian]

Incentive to post frequently beyond what's already offered.

[orphans]

I would like a "Random me!" button. Like.... one that selects something from the crystal ball for you to read?

That'd be nice.

[Zerith]

I say a tournament would be cool, but also bringing back that one thing we used to have where a thread was mentioned every now and then as a good read, earning it's 15 minutes of fame and encouraging people to read it.

[Elrundir]

Yeah, some sort of "What are you reading?" feature would be cool. Not for books, but threads. Even something that everyone can contribute to so that we get a wide range of ideas of what people are following at the moment.

[Sagequeen]

Yeah, some sort of "What are you reading?" feature would be cool. Not for books, but threads. Even something that everyone can contribute to so that we get a wide range of ideas of what people are following at the moment.

To follow your idea, a simple thing would be to add a "What are you reading" forum category (or sub-forum?). It'd be sorted monthly with the previous months' threads locked. In the current month's thread people can share what they are following, as well as what classic/Crystal Ball threads they might be reading. Perhaps they can add why they are following the threads. Seems like a good way to get all the information in one place instead of in a plethora of random threads.

My two cents as a newbie.

[Rayse Valentino]

I want a puppy.

[Atzar]

I'd like to see some new blood as far as regions go - the existing ones are stale to me, and that's some of why I don't write here anymore.

Oh, and do something with the GP hack or drop it - broken/unfinished features are kind of a letdown.

Also, rekroot moar. I don't even know how new people find this place.

On the subject of tournaments, that would be cool. Or just some sort of active feature in general. Or fire and publicly humiliate a moderator and then troll his efforts to explain his side of the story - that's usually good for some activity and entertainment for awhile.

[Amber Eyes]

Wow…this thread was busy while I was gone. Must make Althanas work on my cell so that I have something to do while waiting for hours at the social security office!

What about something like a Mini-archive for people? A specific section on their profiles that is similar to their character profile that acts as an archive that they can mage in their own way and on a timeline? I know people have their posts listed by default by a forum, but maybe something like what's in my signature but on a larger scale?

I love this idea, but I’m not sure exactly how it would be done. Max is all tech-savy and stuff, so if this is even within the realm of possibility I’m sure he’ll look into it.


Tournament plox!

I’m not sure what plox means, but Numbers is heading up features so I’m sure we’ll be having some exciting stuff coming soon!


Tournament, fire Sei, send pics of your jugs to me, Amber Eyes.

Now be honest Slayer, do you only want to fire Sei so that he can’t remove pictures of my breasts from the site?


Incentive to post frequently beyond what's already offered.

What kind of incentives would appeal to you as a writer?


I would like a "Random me!" button. Like.... one that selects something from the crystal ball for you to read?

Another really cool idea…that is way beyond my computer skills….I should probably start a list for Max 


I say a tournament would be cool, but also bringing back that one thing we used to have where a thread was mentioned every now and then as a good read, earning it's 15 minutes of fame and encouraging people to read it.
I will definitely be using this one in my news updates.


Yeah, some sort of "What are you reading?" feature would be cool. Not for books, but threads. Even something that everyone can contribute to so that we get a wide range of ideas of what people are following at the moment.
I love this idea as well…you think this is something that should be viewed on the player’s profile or like a front page most viewed kind of thing?


To follow your idea, a simple thing would be to add a "What are you reading" forum category (or sub-forum?). It'd be sorted monthly with the previous months' threads locked. In the current month's thread people can share what they are following, as well as what classic/Crystal Ball threads they might be reading. Perhaps they can add why they are following the threads. Seems like a good way to get all the information in one place instead of in a plethora of random threads.
I like that; The plan is to get a sub-forum for news and stuff so this would be a good addition.


I want a puppy.

Is this another request for breast pictures? I’m pretty sure they say puppies….:P



I'd like to see some new blood as far as regions go - the existing ones are stale to me, and that's some of why I don't write here anymore.
Oh, and do something with the GP hack or drop it - broken/unfinished features are kind of a letdown.
Also, rekroot moar. I don't even know how new people find this place.
On the subject of tournaments, that would be cool. Or just some sort of active feature in general. Or fire and publicly humiliate a moderator and then troll his efforts to explain his side of the story - that's usually good for some activity and entertainment for awhile.

Hopefully we’ll have some excitement in both features and regions soon. I know Elrundir and Numbers are working on that. Recruitment is something Max and I have been discussing and pretty soon we will have a recruitment team (PM me if you are interested!) As far as the moderator thing goes….wow…that’s just mean…..

[Sheex]

Pie. Oh, though if forced to be serious I support the "what are you reading" idea.

But, mostly I just want some pie.

[The International]

@ Artie - Working on that. Now I know when someone says they're working on it in Althanas it may or may not happen. Trust me that one's a large piecce of what I'm working on right now. Another thing I'm working on is a 'thread of the week/month' feature that's in conjunction with what I'm working on.

@ Atzar - You may want to give the regions we have another chance after we finish reviving some of them. Right now we have quite a few and they aren't being used to their maximum potential.

@ Venessian - I've been thinking about something like that too. Let's see what we can come up with behind the scenes.

@ all you tourney lovers - don't go skipping out on the first few rounds if we do one, or I'm comin' after ya.

@ Rayse - howz abot a full grown husky that gets on my nerves every day? I'll tell my girlfriend he's on a farm with lots of room to run and play.

@ Sheex - Can't do the pie, but I can do a workshop judgement with just as much flava.

[Elrundir]

I love this idea as well…you think this is something that should be viewed on the player’s profile or like a front page most viewed kind of thing?
...
I like that; The plan is to get a sub-forum for news and stuff so this would be a good addition.
Yeah, that's more what I had in mind. A sub-forum or sticky thread or something where people can post links to threads that they're really into at the moment, and why. And maybe the mod can keep up with the thread and organize the information in the main post somehow or... something. I dunno, that sort of thing isn't really my forte, but I'm sure you'd come up with something cool. :p


I'd like to see some new blood as far as regions go - the existing ones are stale to me, and that's some of why I don't write here anymore.
By "new blood," do you mean new regions entirely? If so, I'm not sure that would actually solve our issues with regions--we would spread ourselves that much more thinly and it would result in more of the same thing. I can say that we'll certainly be revisiting the idea of new regions in the future, but top priority would be to try to fix/revive/improve the existing regions first. On that note, is there anything that would achieve that for you (and I open that question to everyone on here; we can start a new thread about it if you like), either specifically about a particular region or about regions in general?

[Atzar]

@ Atzar - You may want to give the regions we have another chance after we finish reviving some of them. Right now we have quite a few and they aren't being used to their maximum potential.

That's not the first time I've heard this, or something to the same effect. A new region writer will come in with big plans, make a few changes - new/updated mission board here, a few more details there - and then... that's it. No following up on what they started. The board might get updated once or twice, but that's it. It just doesn't go anywhere. I'm not trying to offend anybody, but I'll believe it when I see it.


By "new blood," do you mean new regions entirely? If so, I'm not sure that would actually solve our issues with regions--we would spread ourselves that much more thinly and it would result in more of the same thing. I can say that we'll certainly be revisiting the idea of new regions in the future, but top priority would be to try to fix/revive/improve the existing regions first. On that note, is there anything that would achieve that for you (and I open that question to everyone on here; we can start a new thread about it if you like), either specifically about a particular region or about regions in general?

The hard part is striking a balance between accessibility and creativity. None of the regions do that at this point. Those which are accessible feel bland and unoriginal, and those which are creative are hard to break into.

Also, once you do that, keep it moving. I'd rather not see a new paint job, only to let it sit there for another year or two. Keep adding things. Even better, make things happen. I'm not talking about the FQ that Sighter and Ashiakin tried before they vanished; it doesn't need to be on that scale. But if things are happening and changing, then you'd generate a lot more interest and therefore activity.

At this point, many of the stories generated on Althanas are spun together and then just splashed in a random region. Sure, it's on the site, but it doesn't feel like it's a part of Althanas. The only way to avoid that disconnection is to actively create and maintain Althanas storylines. I thought this was supposed to happen as a part of the transition to Althanas 3.0, but (correct me if I'm wrong) the idea just kind of got left on the shelf to collect dust. It's a hell of an idea, and I'd love to see it happen.


Hopefully we’ll have some excitement in both features and regions soon. I know Elrundir and Numbers are working on that. Recruitment is something Max and I have been discussing and pretty soon we will have a recruitment team (PM me if you are interested!) As far as the moderator thing goes….wow…that’s just mean…..

Good to know that it's in the works. I'd be willing to do small tasks for you if you just need an extra pair of hands for awhile or whatever, but I'm not willing to commit a large amount of time anymore.

[Elrundir]

That's not the first time I've heard this, or something to the same effect. A new region writer will come in with big plans, make a few changes - new/updated mission board here, a few more details there - and then... that's it. No following up on what they started. The board might get updated once or twice, but that's it. It just doesn't go anywhere. I'm not trying to offend anybody, but I'll believe it when I see it.

...

The hard part is striking a balance between accessibility and creativity. None of the regions do that at this point. Those which are accessible feel bland and unoriginal, and those which are creative are hard to break into.

Also, once you do that, keep it moving. I'd rather not see a new paint job, only to let it sit there for another year or two. Keep adding things. Even better, make things happen. I'm not talking about the FQ that Sighter and Ashiakin tried before they vanished; it doesn't need to be on that scale. But if things are happening and changing, then you'd generate a lot more interest and therefore activity.

At this point, many of the stories generated on Althanas are spun together and then just splashed in a random region. Sure, it's on the site, but it doesn't feel like it's a part of Althanas. The only way to avoid that disconnection is to actively create and maintain Althanas storylines. I thought this was supposed to happen as a part of the transition to Althanas 3.0, but (correct me if I'm wrong) the idea just kind of got left on the shelf to collect dust. It's a hell of an idea, and I'd love to see it happen.
You're absolutely right about that, which is why region writers have been done away with entirely. It's a concept we've been using for years and it never really worked. Canon Masters replace them by focusing on running quests in (theoretically) all regions that will involve and contribute to the canon. The reason it's going slowly at the moment, and indeed since the launch of 3.0, is a lack of hands--we've currently got one Canon Master (that's me) and one admin in charge of regions (The International), and that's one fewer than we had at launch. So we are working on things, but as quickly as two pairs of hands allow. ^^;;

What I can say is that the focus will be on smaller events (basically on the level of quests, not featured quests) that hopefully will be run with more frequency (again, this depends directly on the number of CMs we have), many of which will move larger events forward step by step. I've already got a bunch of ideas that I'm looking forward to running, including some that I'll post for anyone to run with as they please without needing a CM to run them, and hopefully if we can get enough support on the staffing end we'll see small but continuous motion in all or most of the major regions rather than large, incomplete and infrequent lurches.

(I know you probably already know a lot of this, but I figured it's worth posting out for everyone to see in case anyone wasn't sure what these changes were intended to achieve. :))

[The International]

I'm not trying to offend anybody, but I'll believe it when I see it.

I totally get that, and I know the acts we're following. I don't expect you to believe it until you see it, but I would love to see you stick around and see what we have in store.

[Vigil]

Bring back the Pagoda, reset the ladder and put somebody in charge of managing it.

It drew a lot of activity and was a good alternative to battles for awhile. But seeing as its been a couple of years, it'd be a good idea to start a new season to let new blood have a chance of getting to the top.

As for regions... they are what they are. I stopped caring about breathing life in them about the same time I stopped writing for one of them. They're setpieces, nothing more. I'd like, however, to see Continuity readjusted and the inclusion of official canon removed as a requirement. Isn't necessary and just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

[SirArtemis]

Are vignettes still going on? I know I was pretty active in them for a bit before I disappeared. I enjoyed writing single-post stories with my character. It was a good writing exercise and it was fun to see how many unique perspectives could be taken by a single prompt.

You know, now that I think about it, why not let Sei get some of his joy back with this? Make it so that, like the old vignettes, people would receive gold and exp for participating. But let's say that each vignette has a unique "auction-house" item as the final reward as well? That way, people have an incentive to participate not only for the practice, exp, and gold, but also for a unique item for free that might be tremendously useful and valuable, and something a person did not come up with on their own. The higher the stakes, the more participants, and the higher the quality of writing. After all, if there was something like a masterwork adamantite shortsword as a reward for a vignette, I sure as hell would put a lot of effort into trying to win. And if you want to participate and don't want the item, just put a disclaimer so that the runner up, or 3rd runner up even, gets the reward, so that winners who don't want the item don't get the hog.

After all, I'll admit, there were some really fun and awesome items that I saw pass through the auction house that I just didn't have the money to compete with. Whereas when it comes to vignettes, everyone has an equal chance.

Yeah, I like the idea.

[orphans]

... but I like ribbons and seemingly pointless/frivolous items for my character...

In all seriousness, I feel that Artie has a good suggestion and it can be refined.

[Jasmine]

To answer the question about vignettes: Yes, they are going to come back as their own feature. Hopefully in the very near future. As for a special prize for 1st place, I shall keep the suggestion in mind. :)

[Christoph]

Army battle tournament. That is all. >_>

[Duffy]

^ winner.

Job done.

[Slayer of the Rot]

Now be honest Slayer, do you only want to fire Sei so that he can’t remove pictures of my breasts from the site?


Gee whiz, ya got me.

"Army" tournaments fucking suck. I hate the god damn Gisela. It's gayer than a man wearing pink sequins and a feather boa sucking two dicks and taking two up the ass. So if the general consensus ends up being an army tournament I withdraw my vote for a tournament and give it to bringing back the Pagoda.

[Atzar]

Bring back the Pagoda, reset the ladder and put somebody in charge of managing it.

It drew a lot of activity and was a good alternative to battles for awhile. But seeing as its been a couple of years, it'd be a good idea to start a new season to let new blood have a chance of getting to the top.

As for regions... they are what they are. I stopped caring about breathing life in them about the same time I stopped writing for one of them. They're setpieces, nothing more. I'd like, however, to see Continuity readjusted and the inclusion of official canon removed as a requirement. Isn't necessary and just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

As a one-time reincarnator of the Dajas Pagoda, please yes.

On the subject of Continuity, also please yes. I dislike the Continuity category. I've long since accepted the fact that a judge's score isn't perfectly representative of the quality of a piece - my favorite read on this site isn't even particularly close to being a JC - but Continuity takes this to a level that I'm not comfortable with.

I'd recommend a reward boost for threads that utilize/contribute to Althanas canon, rather than a penalty for a superb thread that doesn't take place in Corone. There are many excellent stories out there, but not all of them fit within the confines of the established major regions here.

Obviously, this is a slippery slope. You wouldn't want to let that railgun back into Althanas on the excuse that some tiny society on some random unnamed island in an unknown corner of the planet has modern technology. But within reason, I think most things should fly here.

[Symbiosis]

For the love of god, get rid of that continuity crap. I'm sorry but i don't think it's fair to have a score that hinges on you role playing in Corone or Scara Brae or Underwood. I think it's a trap for people who use outlands and lose out on scores being good because HERP DE DERP you didn't write about some silly civil war.

I agree with Atzar. Make a reward system for canon work, but don't penalize people who just enjoying writing.

[Arden]

Continuity is not just about canonisation.

It reflects internal continuing, character development, past references to previous threads, hints at threads set in the future.

It's reverence of story time, not idolisation of the Almanac.

To get a higher score you need to refer to Althanas and the world, however you do it. One name in a post, one slight comment here or there is all it takes.

Even your setting, describing the scene and sticking to your description to bring a place to life affects continuity.

If you feel it's stifling you, then why play in a set world role-play altogether?

There's nothing stopping you writing your own island or empire on any part of the undiscovered world, but continuum is an integral part of the writing process, without which threads would be ten post vignettes with little or no relation to character, history, location or reality (in a truly hyperbole example).

[Letho]

What Duffy said.

And also what Slayer said. Army battle tournaments are boring and gay.

[Sheex]

This is kind of against my nature, but....


Continuity: Continuity is ten points on the rubric. It focuses on how well a character fit into the Althanas canon, or how the Althanas canon related to the character? Did the character go to Fallien but play it out as a jungle setting? Did anybody in Akashima speak a foreign (asian) langauge that your character was not familiar with? Did they roleplay Knife's Edge being destroyed (as is current) or continued as if nothing happened? A good writer makes sure he knows the canon of the area he's writing in, and is able to grade a character on it thoroughly. A five would mean the character acknowledged he was in Fallien, and had a couple of details to incorporate it (a hot sun, lightly dressed people), where as a 10 puts forth excruciating details to make sure anybody who reads knows exactly what Fallien is all about, and enthralls them to do threads there personally.

Straight from the handbook. Unless that thing has been updated without...er...being updated, then it seems to me that continuity has nothing to do with character outside of "how is this related to Althanas?" Past threads are irrelevant, unless they too are in some way related to Althanas timeline. Character growth is irrelevant too, unless it relates to Althanas timeline. Character of course fills this gap, but personally, I have to side with the "this is bad" group. Could be reading it wrong, but I don't think I am.

Though I suppose to be fair, minus ten points to me really doesn't bug me if I wrote what I wanted to write.

[The International]

As for the Pagoda. It's a good idea. A tournament is in the works, and once that's done we'll see what we can do about bringing that back.

As for the Continuity, we'll update the category to accommodate character driven stories. Honestly, as a judge I've been looking at personal continuity as well as world continuity. Sheex if I had to put a number to the Continuity category for you it would have been pretty high because I take personal progression of the character just as seriously as the story world. I didn't take away any points because you weren't in one of the main regions. I encouraged you to put your character in Althanas regions because I think he'd make a wonderful addition to the main world. That Handbook description is out of date as are other things around here, so I'll add refining that description to my list. As for world continuity, to be frank it is a writer's obligation to inform the reader where and when a story is taking place. Even if it's just a backdrop the reader needs to know.

I will admit that we haven't been given the resources to do that well. That's about to change.

[Knave]

I'd just like to step in and say: screw you nay sayers, Gisela sounds like a thing to do!

And for those talking about continuity, no that is not our current definition in the handbook, but just the same this is a place with a story built in. Please don't think of yourselves as being penalized for choosing to ignore a facet of the site. The maximum amount we allot totals to 100, whether you choose to do your homework and fill in the blanks is entirely open to the author upon their own work. The fact of the matter is that this is not the public school system, you do not start at one hundred points and go down, I don't think anyone is being punished for not standing in line properly and donning their elf ears.

But if it were the public school system, some people do their homework, and, hey, even do the extra-credit, so when they get their paper back it should be no hard surprise that some grades are higher (not nesecesarily better) than others.

^__^ <== Moderate student, the disappointment of the mediocre class. Lazy bastard.

[Elrundir]

Quite a bit of information in the handbook is out of date, but it's difficult to change, and the updating work we can do is slow with only two pairs of hands. :( Nevertheless, I do think continuity in an of itself is an important category, because it does (or should) encompass a lot of things besides just "where in Althanas is this taking place and how well do you understand the region?" Continuity within a character's own personal growth and development is important too, and even keeping continuity within a thread or a set of threads (e.g., if you reference something from a previous thread, probably best if it actually happened in that thread). To get the maximum score, you'd have to demonstrate some sort of willingness to use one of the canon regions and place yourself somewhere in that continuum, to bring forward some sort of understanding of where that nation has come from and why it is the way it is (and, this is key, using whatever resources are available to you--nobody could possibly penalize you for filling in the blanks on stuff about, say, Fallien that has never been written before, and you might even get it added to the canon besides). That's why they're there, but there's no reason you couldn't get a perfectly good score just by respecting your own character's continuity and the continuity of your threads.

So, to that end, I'd certainly support having the description of continuity reviewed to make sure all judges are looking at it the same way, but removing the category entirely I would not. At least, not without a better argument than "it limits creativity," because in ten years of writing here I've never felt that it does.

[Enigmatic Immortal]

I know it may be hard to do this, but we need to update what the handbook says on our judgment if not anything else. Continuity always left me a bit sour because a lot of the stories I write I only mention Althanas maybe once, twice or so. This is a fantasy Role Play writer's site, which was what brought me in the first place. So I'm sorry, Duffy, but your words to me about how it's fair to judge lower scores because I didn't play or mutter the words Corone just doesn't seem fair. However, i'm not debating this, it's an opinion and everyone has one. (Except Letho, he has the secret third option Red heads)

In fact, I'm not debating anything at all. So far this thread has been great at keeping the debating and flaming down. So I want to proceed with the purest of intentions that I am only going to show examples of past judged work of why Continuity bugs the shit out of me. I hope, in good faith, the moderators can see the gripes and complaints being presented and act accordingly. These examples show works for various judges and give support that some use Continuity as intended, some use it like the handbook word for word, and some use it without even giving a damn about the actual definition given to us.


Scored a 4 because at while I mentioned where in the world I was, and how so forth, It never felt like I was in Althanas. (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?23045-Strange-Bed-Fellows&p=187163#post187163) This is where I get miffed and annoyed. Some judge's say just sprinkle some Althanas into your stories. Well i started in Salvar, mentioned the nation numerous times, talked about how I was going to Corone to write about the Civil war, but gee wilickers the story took place on a BOAT. Now, do i get where the judge came from, YES, I do, but that's not the point. The point is soon to come.

I'm not a fan of this judgement, the only one i ever asked to be rejudged. (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?19913-A-Rhapsody-Of-Bittersweet-Memories&p=175812#post175812) However, Ironically, Continuity scored a, of all small wonders, a five. Why is that strange? Because, well, we never mentioned Althanas at all. I mean AT ALL. The story took place in a make believe world called Emprea and war ravished the land. We didn't talk about Fallien, Corone, Scara Brae, but we got a five...huh?

This scored a 3 (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?22601-My-self.-My-shadow.) But not because it didn't take place in Althanas. It was because it had little to progress the man's story. It had no Continuity in his background. No mention at all of where in Althanas this took place. Just focused on the character.

Here's another 5. (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?21534-Children-Of-the-Shattered-Moon-%28Solo%29&p=174595#post174595) Sei gave a five because he couldn't keep track of NPC's, and the so forth. But the story wasn't about Althanas, it wasn't even ON Althanas. It was in a different dimension or world or something epically cool!

Here's a nine. (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?22018-In-Her-Web-She-s-Caught-%28Solo%29&p=184497#post184497) This Is a good example of a nine I think, but the first sentence bothers me. It's all about how you tied it into Althanas. Now the next example, please.

scored a 6. (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?22861-A-Past-Life-%28Solo%29&p=184985#post184985) First sentence bugs me, because you changed your mind! It's tricky, because you played in Outlands. And if you connect your story with the Althanas story, you'll score more! And International, I'm not attacking you here, and it it seems I am, I'm sorry. You're a great judge, but you see the issues here?

So, according to this, I have mentioned the Demon Wars as an integral part to Emprea's founding, the first unnamed Barbarian King killing Raziel the Demon Overlord for that Hellmouth and freeing his land from demonic poison. Do I score a 7+ now? You can still score me a 0, I'm keeping that storyline. But if that was all i mentioned, do i drop to a three? If I took place in the Corone Civil war, do i auto score a 5? If I play in outlands, do I auto score lower than a 7? I know nobody auto scores peopel's threads, and judging is never going to be consistent from one to another, but this is a wide degree of variance that really needs to be looked at.

Continuity needs to have...Continuity. We need to update the handbook so it reflects what all judges are going to base it on. And then all judges need to agree to judge by this manner. That's what I would like to see. Continuity just doesn't sit well in it's current form. If we change it to what International and Elrundir (Spelling?) have mentioned it should be about, I'm doen. My gripes are washed away, and I'll be happy. At this rate, writing in Outlands just feels like your walking into a low continuity score. But until I see the greater importance of tying this into Althanas or consistency of how much I have to tie in (Be it a sprinkle of a mention, or just avoid using outlands) then i'll be sad panda... and nobody likes a sad panda.

Also, to liven the mood, is impactful a real word? My spelly thingy ma jig is telling me it's not, and I think it is....

[Atzar]

To get a higher score you need to refer to Althanas and the world, however you do it. One name in a post, one slight comment here or there is all it takes.

So say I have a backward, native island people well to the south of any of the established regions. What reason would they have to be aware of Corone or Salvar? Honest question. I mean, I suppose I could do one of those dream sequences in which he see some of the Civil War or something, but then that entire passage would have nothing to do with the rest of my quest. Ask Artemis about this: I hate loose ends. I want everything within a thread to contribute to the culmination of the thread. A random this-post-is-for-continuity-points might well grab me an extra point or two in Continuity because I "did my research", but it's going to hurt the rest of the thread.

tl;dr: many Outlands threads just have nothing to do with the major regions, and there's no good way to shoehorn them in.


Even your setting, describing the scene and sticking to your description to bring a place to life affects continuity.

If you feel it's stifling you, then why play in a set world role-play altogether?

I don't feel that the other stuff stifles me. I feel that having to refer to Althanas canon when it does nothing to help my story stifles me. If it got back to simple character and story continuity, then I'd get back to not having a problem with continuity.

And as for the 'why play in a set world at all', you have a good point - I haven't been. I'm actually in the process of putting together my own world with its own story. I miss out on the best parts of Althanas by doing so, though - the community.


There's nothing stopping you writing your own island or empire on any part of the undiscovered world, but continuum is an integral part of the writing process, without which threads would be ten post vignettes with little or no relation to character, history, location or reality (in a truly hyperbole example).

Oh stop. You even acknowledge yourself that this is over-the-top.


Continuity within a character's own personal growth and development is important too, and even keeping continuity within a thread or a set of threads (e.g., if you reference something from a previous thread, probably best if it actually happened in that thread).

That's what I want Continuity to be. I have no problem with that. I like that.


To get the maximum score, you'd have to demonstrate some sort of willingness to use one of the canon regions and place yourself somewhere in that continuum, to bring forward some sort of understanding of where that nation has come from and why it is the way it is (and, this is key, using whatever resources are available to you--nobody could possibly penalize you for filling in the blanks on stuff about, say, Fallien that has never been written before, and you might even get it added to the canon besides).

Why, though? Why doesn't an excellent, well-developed story get full marks even though it doesn't take place in Raiaera? To me, It's an unnecessary restriction that has no bearing whatsoever on the quality of a story.

[The International]

As far as I'm concerned you're all beating a dead horse now. We said we would have it updated, and we also said we would soon provide what the players need to raise their continuity scores concerning the story world. Now I know you're not used to staff members willing to acknowledge a flaw in the system, but you just wasted a lot of time proving something that just about everyone already knew and agreed on. We are not removing Continuity, but we will be updating it to include character driven Continuity. I could explain my reasoning behind both scores here, but that's off subject. I happily invite you to make another thread so we can get back to more requests on this one. Now let's move on.

[Vigil]

Continuity is not just about canonisation.

It reflects internal continuing, character development, past references to previous threads, hints at threads set in the future.

It's reverence of story time, not idolisation of the Almanac.

To get a higher score you need to refer to Althanas and the world, however you do it. One name in a post, one slight comment here or there is all it takes.

The judge is evaluating and critiquing me and my thread. Or yours, for example. There is little reason why I should have to sprinkle useless trivia over a region I'm in in an unnecessary and dumb segue to appease the rubric and give the judge peace of mind. The content of what I write, my character's growth in the story and how well he and the other characters interact in the story should be up for evaluation. Continuity reflects, in my opinion, the momentum of the story, the pacing and how well it runs together.

[SirArtemis]

Moving away from this nonsense, I have something else I want.

Now, this something might take some time, and I just spotted it while getting my friend involved in this the other day. I realized that there's a lot of information available for the world of Althanas, but some of it is either inconsistent, out of date, or even contradictory.

With this, I'm willing to help out. The almanac has some cool aspects and information about regions, but they are brief. Some of them don't even make sense. For example, I see that Scara Brae has major imports of lumber, while scrolling up I see the map that shows a forest that takes up at least 1/4 of the entire island. Or I see a major export of Salvar being lumber, when I envisioned Salvar as being more like... this tundra (http://www.marietta.edu/~biol/biomes/images/tundra/alaskapipeline1.jpg)

I also feel like it might be useful to create a bestiary of some creatures that people might encounter.

I sometimes envision playing Althanas somewhat like Dungeons and Dragons. For those who know anything about that, you will know that there is an overwhelming amount of information for players to choose from. From religions, to regions, to histories, classes, enemies, factions, magics, and so forth. It is a massive-scale database. Althanas should at least have something to help move toward that, with some parts as more important than others. I.e. the history and landscape would be more important than religions and the bestiary.

[Sheex]

Sheex if I had to put a number to the Continuity category for you it would have been pretty high because I take personal progression of the character just as seriously as the story world. I didn't take away any points because you weren't in one of the main regions.

Whoa, whoa whoa! Sorry if I gave the impression that I was upset with the scoring, or I thought I lost points. I'm actually totally happy with your judgement. That's it, from now on I'm picking Letho's secret third option. Redheads.

[Max Dirks]

Althanas should at least have something to help move toward that, with some parts as more important than others. I.e. the history and landscape would be more important than religions and the bestiary.Good points. Fortunately, The International and Taskmienster share your vision.

Here's (www.althanas.com/wiki) what they've done (so far).
Here's (http://www.althanas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Corone) an example of Corone's entry.

Does this satisfy your hunger, Mr. Artemis?

[Max Dirks]

Double post!

This is ripped from the Judge's Handbook.

"Continuity: This score takes into consideration several important elements, and provides strong connections to the other areas of the rubric. If the answer to all of the following questions is a non-hesitant 'yes' then the thread most likely deserves a 9-10 in this category. Advanced writing is really not needed for this, moreso solid focus and good editing skills.
-were the descriptions/actions of the setting and characters consistent? Was any growth/change logical or at least tangible? Did they make sense within the context of the story?
-do the descriptions/actions of the setting and characters reflect goings on in Althanas canon for the appropriate time period?
-do the descriptions/actions of the setting and characters build upon available Althanas lore? (a high-scoring thread should both reflect and interact/build upon Althanas canon)
-did reading the thread feel like Althanas? Did reading about the specific region inspire you to learn more/write there yourself?"

This is what your judges base your score on. Does this help explain how continuity is used?

[Atzar]

It's not that I don't understand what it is. I do. I just don't like what it is.

[Dianus Ogham]

Artemis, I think Hysteria tried to get people involved in a Bestiary thread for Althanas a while back.

It pretty much fell by the wayside, but I imagine it's something that wouldn't be beyond completion now; there's plenty tucked away to cut and paste, and I'm sure once something forms, people will contribute their own creations.

[SirArtemis]

Good points. Fortunately, The International and Taskmienster share your vision.

Here's (www.althanas.com/wiki) what they've done (so far).
Here's (http://www.althanas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Corone) an example of Corone's entry.

Does this satisfy your hunger, Mr. Artemis?

I actually love the Corone article. I just wish there was not only a map that was prettier (like the ones The Internation is working on) but also articles like that for all of the regions. Not only that, but it'd be cool to get some maps of the major cities within regions as well. Of course, I know this takes time. I'm just saying it's something I very much look forward to.



Artemis, I think Hysteria tried to get people involved in a Bestiary thread for Althanas a while back.

It pretty much fell by the wayside, but I imagine it's something that wouldn't be beyond completion now; there's plenty tucked away to cut and paste, and I'm sure once something forms, people will contribute their own creations.

As for this, it's really not all that much. I'm just saying get a general sense of what creatures exist, maybe some fictional ones as well as common ones like wolves and the sort, and say which ones are common to where.

[The International]

I'll do maps of countries, but I am of the opinion that it would be counter productive to make maps for cities. The reason being it is a visual restriction. For example, if a player mentions Radasanth's warehouse district and I don't have one in the map he or she might hesitate to take that liberty. If we have open ended discriptions that say "there are many districts to Radasanth, but these are the main six..." there's nothing stoping the player from taking a liberty or two and making the warehouse district one of those 'many districts'. That would be a good thing.

Oh and go to the top of that corone article and click on the link that says 'regions' and you'll see that we've provided just as much if not more information for every region.

[Elrundir]

For the record, Raiaera's wiki page (http://www.althanas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Raiaera) is just about complete too. There's more I'd like to have in there, but these wiki pages are surprisingly restrictive of the amount of data you can put in them. -_-;; No map on it at present, but I'd rather just wait until The International is finished with his because they're ever so pretty and more up to date anyway.

[Inalitalllane]

Hey,
I know I'm new, but if there was anything I'd like to see in Althanas, it's less combat-related XP scenarios. Not every character is built for combat, and while there are several cool characters out there centering on combat, there are also characters out there centering on knowledge or other strange quests.

So far, from what I'm gathering, Althanas only rewards warriors and not scholars.

Also, having a search tool that allows you to narrow down and sort the data in peoples' profiles would be quite handy. That way when others need to seek "elven mages," they can find all of the active members who are. ^_^

Another point of note is the actual design of the website. VBulletin does have look and feel customization options and I think it would be cool if Althanas had its own theme. :)

Lastly, the process of grading here really needs help. I'm a web designer and developer, so this is probably just my programming side talking, but I believe that the site might benefit from some automation so things may be sped up and to prevent bias. Perhaps implementing a star rating system would save a lot of people a lot of time and aggravation. :)

I don't feel that judging people (especially newcomers) on their writing is particularly wise as a lot of people have different writing styles. RPG's, I think, would be better suited toward a score system based more on terms of Game Mechanics than Writing Mechanics.

Maybe instead of developing on these others "Writing Elements," they could be actual game stats (i.e. Combat ability, stealth ability). More of the content of the characters' actions rather than the syntax of the writing. You're liable to step onto a lot of toes here.

Again, I'm new and this is my amateur opinion, but I feel that there are certain things Althanas is doing that isn't very, "New Person Friendly."

Not that this has any merit, but I've been to a lot of up-and-coming forums and a lot of them are making the same mistakes: they are becoming set in their ways regarding their current community while not cultivating for new members. This doesn't mean, "Take care of the new people and screw the old members," but there shouldn't be any favoritism. Perhaps a mentoring system is wise here - a benefit for older members actively engaging and helping new ones.

There are other things that have to do with this also: eye level retention and user-friendliness on a website. User-friendliness when starting a game. Ease of experience gained. All of these things directly correlate to a formula of increased traffic, quality growth, and overall satisfaction.

That's really all I can think of right now! Thanks!

~Indi

[SirArtemis]

Hey,
I know I'm new, but if there was anything I'd like to see in Althanas, it's less combat-related XP scenarios. Not every character is built for combat, and while there are several cool characters out there centering on combat, there are also characters out there centering on knowledge or other strange quests.

So far, from what I'm gathering, Althanas only rewards warriors and not scholars.

To be honest, you can write whatever you want. There is nothing limiting someone for writing any stories that are unrelated to combat. In fact, the solo I am currently working on has no combat whatsoever. As long as you are writing a good story, you have just as much chance to score 100 as someone who is writing something combat related. After all, there's nothing in the rubric specifically geared toward combat.


Also, having a search tool that allows you to narrow down and sort the data in peoples' profiles would be quite handy. That way when others need to seek "elven mages," they can find all of the active members who are. ^_^

This is probably just something related to applying keywords to profiles.


Has anyone thought of setting up schools for mages...or just schools in general?

You could do something like this if you'd like, whether in your stories themselves or in a power group format. I don't see why you couldn't write something like this.



Lastly, the grading system here really needs help. I'm a web designer and developer, so this is probably just my programming side talking when I believe that computers should be doing some jobs that people shouldn't to prevent bias. Perhaps implementing a star rating system would save a lot of people a lot of time and aggravation. :)

I don't feel that judging people (especially newcomers) on their writing is particularly wise as a lot of people have different writing styles. RPG's, I think, would be better suited toward a score system based more on terms of Game Mechanics than Writing Mechanics.

Maybe instead of developing on these others "Writing Elements," they could be actual game stats (i.e. Combat ability, stealth ability). More of the content of the characters' actions rather than the syntax of the writing. You're liable to step onto a lot of toes here.

This website is specifically and intentionally geared more toward writing rather than game mechanics, as the whole premise is more of a writer's workshop rather than a game. It is a niche type of website and obviously not for everyone. However, even so, mechanics is only one of ten categories, and even if your story is littered with typos, as long as you are clear and the story itself is good, you could score better overall than someone who is wonderful with mechanics but has awful visoin.



Perhaps a mentoring system is wise here - a benefit for older members actively engaging and helping new ones.

One of the ways this is done is that if people want to work with other writers, they can look for people to write a story with. For example, you can see some veteran writers actively looking for people to write with, sometimes complete newbies. Most people on the website are willing to write with anyone if asked.

Not only that, but the writer's workshop is an area where you can submit your thread and get feedback specifically from other writers, not just the judges.


There are other things that have to do with this also: eye level retention and user-friendliness on a website. User-friendliness when starting a game. Ease of experience gained. All of these things directly correlate to a formula that causes a site to grow.

The experience really isn't that hard to gain on this website. You could level up incredibly fast if you just spam stories, even if of mediocre quality. It only takes a few threads to level up the first time, and that's generally consistent.


Side note, totally not trying to sound like a jerk and I apologize if it comes off that way. I was just giving my two cents on some of the comments.

[The International]

We don't need combat. We need conflict. There's a difference. I'll also refer to one Relt Peltfelter, whose current character has no combat skills and still scores very well.

I'll let someone else handle the rest.

[Duffy]

Several of my characters are non-combat, and quite a lot of my current threads feature...well, talking.

Horrifying I know, but it's do-able.

Fighting is for pussies, anyway, what this site needs more of is DRAMA!

[Inalitalllane]

This website is specifically and intentionally geared more toward writing rather than game mechanics, as the whole premise is more of a writer's workshop rather than a game. It is a niche type of website and obviously not for everyone. However, even so, mechanics is only one of ten categories, and even if your story is littered with typos, as long as you are clear and the story itself is good, you could score better overall than someone who is wonderful with mechanics but has awful visoin.



Alas, I and my friends have wasted our time here, I fear. You see, when I go on Google and search for Fantasy Role Playing Games, I get you guys on search. I wasn't aware Althanas was such a cleverly disguised writer's workshop. But then again, I guess it's right on the first page.

Your problem is your ease of information and your assumption that new users have access to this information. I have attached some links for you to show you the "flow" of a new person's attention span through this website.

http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/1.png
http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/2.png (http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/1.png)
http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/3.png (http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/1.png)

I also fear that the whole point of what I was trying to say is totally missed. Althanas doesn't need more drama or conflict, Althanas needs to MOTIVATE PEOPLE TO PARTICIPATE IN THAT CONFLICT by making its information EASILY ACCESSIBLE. If this is such a 'niche' thing. "Niche" implies you're only catering to some. If you want to cater to some, then don't change anything. But if you want to get NEW people in here, you're heading for a slow death with your current system, because an 85% retention rate is just non-viable as a way to operate.

Example:

I'll also refer to one Relt Peltfelter, whose current character has no combat skills and still scores very well.
I do apologize. I'm sorry I haven't had three years to peruse the website and memorize every single person here.


I'll let someone else handle the rest.

If you were going to dismiss me on a thread asking how you can improve, I'm done here. Why was a thread created discussing improvements to the website if all you're going to do is shut down constructive criticisms? I admit I'm new, it wasn't as though the information you provided your counterpoint with was at any time readily available to any participants other than what could be discerned by seasoned veterans.

But if that's who you're catering to, then your website is fine.

Also, why should I read through every new character sheet if 85% of them are gone?

Please don't kid me here. I'm quite done.

[Max Dirks]

Inalitalllane, I might be a relic, but I've supported Althanas being an RPG over a creative writing website since the beginning.

I think you've discovered the most fundamental (and the most touchy) issue on Althanas: is it a creative writing website or a role-playing game? As much as it pains me to say this, it's both. It will always be both. Since the 3.0 roll out in January, we've done several things to cater to all sorts of players. We have a judgment system that offers complete judgments or workshops (for writers), or simple judgments (for role-players); we reworked the rubric so it doesn't favor one type of player over another (an equal number of RP categories as writing categories); we also made it easier to level up and grow characters (for retention, of course); and finally, we capped out characters to increase replay value.

I like that you and your friends are here, and I'm pretty sure you're going to find tons of folks who like playing with you. When you say "combat" though, I have to ask: do you mean combat within a story (like battles), or competitive RP (which is between players)? While its true a lot of our features promote "battles," we're really attempting to promote "competitive RP." I just think its easier in "competitive RP" for players simply to have their characters fight, but that's not always the case. Instead of saying "lots of people have done this", I'll just give you an example. This was in a tournament. Most of the others in the tournament were "battling," but these two folks decided to "quest" instead.

http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?12689-1-v-1-Argentum-Astrum-vs.-The-Bandit-Brotherhood

Also, is that site you hosted those images on yours? If so, would you like me to add it to our links section?

[Duffy]

An issue was raised concerning the clarity in the rubric and the stagnation of the information in the Almanac concerning that category.

Staff have expressed, quite quickly and simply that they will amend this issue.

People still chose to flog dead horses after this, which is precisely why change on Althanas is so glacial; two sides butt heads, argument ad infinitum.

Althanas is still undergoing a turbulent time. One wave of disruption comes from the representatively recent and rather massive change from one 'version' to another.

The second comes from a very rough time full of staff absences, arguments and resignations (myself included in the latter category) and any mass chaos in the workforce of any business (since you're so keen to operate on the idea that Althanas should be a manufactured, empirically run outlet and not the writer's workshop it has always been - and I hate using that description oh so much) is damaging in the long run and sometimes difficult to recover from.

Despite all of this, things appear to have levelled out, and the judgement process, Realm of Greeting and site renewal processes seem to have been kick-started by a stronger moderating team. Yes, this argument had been done to death before, and yes, I can appreciate it that the site is difficult to navigate for first time potential members, but all the information required is represented somewhere on the website.

If navigation can be made easier for everyone, I'm all for it, but then again, I can find everything I need on the merit of having looked for it or having asked. It is difficult for me, or any of the more 'veteran' members to remember how we felt when we first arrived. It is difficult to remember the troubles we may have encountered, though I don't recall any particular issue with getting to grips with basic canon, statistics about the regions or how the site worked as far as mechanics, the rubric and so forth went.

All I can say is that I endured that entrance period, and swiftly find myself, two years later, regretting nothing about clicking on the Althanas link all those many moons ago. It is a site that gives as much as you give, despite all it's flaws and occasional diamonds in the rough. If you give up now, at the first hurdle, you are not giving it the opportunity it deserves, because it's invariably perception of the people and the timing of your joining that makes or breaks how much enjoyment you get from this little corner of the internet.

[Rayse Valentino]

Alas, I and my friends have wasted our time here, I fear. You see, when I go on Google and search for Fantasy Role Playing Games, I get you guys on search. I wasn't aware Althanas was such a cleverly disguised writer's workshop. But then again, I guess it's right on the first page.

Your problem is your ease of information and your assumption that new users have access to this information. I have attached some links for you to show you the "flow" of a new person's attention span through this website.

http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/1.png
http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/2.png (http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/1.png)
http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/3.png (http://www.akihabaracosplay.com/images/althanas/1.png)

I also fear that the whole point of what I was trying to say is totally missed. Althanas doesn't need more drama or conflict, Althanas needs to MOTIVATE PEOPLE TO PARTICIPATE IN THAT CONFLICT by making its information EASILY ACCESSIBLE. If this is such a 'niche' thing. "Niche" implies you're only catering to some. If you want to cater to some, then don't change anything. But if you want to get NEW people in here, you're heading for a slow death with your current system, because an 85% retention rate is just non-viable as a way to operate.

Example:

I do apologize. I'm sorry I haven't had three years to peruse the website and memorize every single person here.



If you were going to dismiss me on a thread asking how you can improve, I'm done here. Why was a thread created discussing improvements to the website if all you're going to do is shut down constructive criticisms? I admit I'm new, it wasn't as though the information you provided your counterpoint with was at any time readily available to any participants other than what could be discerned by seasoned veterans.

But if that's who you're catering to, then your website is fine.

Also, why should I read through every new character sheet if 85% of them are gone?

Please don't kid me here. I'm quite done.

I just want to say that I'm with you 100% on everything you're saying here.

[Glass]

Just so we’re all clear, I have not been keeping up with this. However, with that said, what bits and pieces I’ve picked up on have drawn my attention to the fact that there seems to be some manner of conflict over “ease of access” to information on Althanas.

First of all, no matter how the information required to play a game is presented someone will have a difficult time locating it. I myself have had very little trouble finding what I needed concerning character creation and the like, and while it took me a little time to find more intricate data on each individual local, it was still available (better than some of the other sites I’ve been a part of).

Now, I’m not saying there isn’t room for improvement, but there is always room for improvement, always… Personally, and this might just be me (which I suppose is why I started this sentence with personally) if I’ve a problem finding something I am looking for, I’ll ask someone who has been ‘ere longer than I. Usually doing this is well received, because, lets be honest, most of us who do this are out here to share our writing with one another and improve not only our own prowess but aid others in doing the same, and if that requires answering a few questions about navigating the website every now and then, so be it, right?

Places like Althanas depend on communication, and that is in every aspect, be it about building a new and fantastic character to throw at Duffy’s head or a simple question of clarity about something an opponent did during a spar. Just astonishes me how skittish so many people seem to be (most of which claim to be veteran Role Players) when they step foot onto a new playground, and not just any playground, one which is built with a plethora and team-based attractions which require at least some manner of human interaction (more or less, but you get what I mean).

I’m not trying to jump on anyone’s case. In fact, that is the last thing I want to do, considering I probably won’t actually look back in on this thread anytime soon (but that could always change).

In any case, my point is that, while the information may not be presented in the most friendliest and easiest of ways, there are more than enough people online at any given time that I would be willing to bet money on would jump at the chance to be a hero and help the new guy (or girl) out.

[Konnal]

A central repository for canonized lore, and official rules would be helpful. A Google search revealed an Althanas wiki, which is essentially what i'm suggesting, but it looks abandoned. I'd even be interested in working on starting/reviving/updating a wiki if those in charge were interested in such a thing.

[The International]

I do apologize. I'm sorry I haven't had three years to peruse the website and memorize every single person here.
I was honestly just trying to show you that you don't have to be combat oriented to be successful on this site. I didn't see anything snide or mean about how I did it.

If you were going to dismiss me on a thread asking how you can improve, I'm done here.
I also wasn't trying to dismiss you either. I just though it would be better for one of your fellow players to tell you that this a writers workshop as much as a game, and he did. Hearing it from my mouth isn't going to make it any more true, but maybe hearing it from someone like Sir Artemis would have helped.

Althanas doesn't need more drama or conflict, Althanas needs to MOTIVATE PEOPLE TO PARTICIPATE IN THAT CONFLICT by making its information EASILY ACCESSIBLE.
We are making a Wiki, it's almost complete, and we will be giving the site access to it as soon as we're done. I actually said that on the third page several times, but I understand if you didn't read the whole thing.

[Elrundir]

A central repository for canonized lore, and official rules would be helpful. A Google search revealed an Althanas wiki, which is essentially what i'm suggesting, but it looks abandoned. I'd even be interested in working on starting/reviving/updating a wiki if those in charge were interested in such a thing.
It's definitely not abandoned. It's just the responsibility of a particular branch of the staff that only has two people in it right now. ^^;; If you check out the Recent Changes in that wiki I think you'll see that whatever pages we have been working on have been pretty active over the past couple of weeks; it's just a matter of how quickly we can cover ground with only two people. But yeah, definitely not abandoned, so keep checking back. :)

(And for those who may be wondering why the wiki is not linked somewhere nice and official and obvious on the site itself, it's because it's not "ready" to open yet. But as you can see, if you Google you shall find, so nobody's going to stop you from taking a peek or two. Or several. :p)


Hey,
I know I'm new, but if there was anything I'd like to see in Althanas, it's less combat-related XP scenarios. Not every character is built for combat, and while there are several cool characters out there centering on combat, there are also characters out there centering on knowledge or other strange quests.

So far, from what I'm gathering, Althanas only rewards warriors and not scholars.
I do hope that isn't actually the case, which is why I want to ask: what is it specifically that's given you that impression? That's an honest question, not an accusatory one. Over the years, I've seen many quests that center around dialogue and character growth and exploration and non-combatty things like that. They are definitely 100% viable, especially with more recent iterations of the rubric that have taken focus specifically off the battles. I know you wouldn't realize that as a new player, but believe me when I say that previous rubrics just about openly promoted battles.


Lastly, the process of grading here really needs help. I'm a web designer and developer, so this is probably just my programming side talking, but I believe that the site might benefit from some automation so things may be sped up and to prevent bias. Perhaps implementing a star rating system would save a lot of people a lot of time and aggravation. :)

I don't feel that judging people (especially newcomers) on their writing is particularly wise as a lot of people have different writing styles. RPG's, I think, would be better suited toward a score system based more on terms of Game Mechanics than Writing Mechanics.

Maybe instead of developing on these others "Writing Elements," they could be actual game stats (i.e. Combat ability, stealth ability). More of the content of the characters' actions rather than the syntax of the writing. You're liable to step onto a lot of toes here.
This is also one of those things that has danced back and forth and back again over the ten years that we've been open. It seems like sometimes we call Althanas an RPG and other times we call it a Writing Workshop and other times we call it some combination of the two. I understand where you're coming from regarding the judging of people who are here more for the "game" aspect than the "writing" aspect, but I would ask you to please remember that for some people--myself included--the opposite is true: we're here for the writing more than (or as much as) the game. Striking a balance between the two is extremely difficult, but I think there are plenty of things to satisfy both sides of the divide. There are plenty of opportunities for leveling up your character and getting progressively more powerful skills and finding magical items and what-not, and even if your writing is not what you'd consider your strong suit, it's not going to critically hurt your progression. Unless, perhaps, your writing is literally unreadable, but that's a whole different story; the categories in the rubric that do relate to writing specifically are more about the mechanical aspects of it: how accurate are your spelling/grammar (the worst parts of which a program like Microsoft Word will fix for you), and how clearly can you express what you're trying to say? (Either of those things, by the way, could be problematic even if we went with purely a "game-based" system--if I can't understand what the heck I'm reading because of poor mechanics and even worse clarity, there's no way I'd be able to properly judge the outcome of an event.)


Not that this has any merit, but I've been to a lot of up-and-coming forums and a lot of them are making the same mistakes: they are becoming set in their ways regarding their current community while not cultivating for new members. This doesn't mean, "Take care of the new people and screw the old members," but there shouldn't be any favoritism. Perhaps a mentoring system is wise here - a benefit for older members actively engaging and helping new ones.

There are other things that have to do with this also: eye level retention and user-friendliness on a website. User-friendliness when starting a game. Ease of experience gained. All of these things directly correlate to a formula of increased traffic, quality growth, and overall satisfaction.

That's really all I can think of right now! Thanks!

~Indi
You're right, the divide between new users and old is a tricky one here. Part of the problem, I think, is that this is a self-sustaining issue: namely, if we have poor retention of new users, then we don't have new users to ask why they didn't stick around. ;) All of us oldies found various reasons that we stuck around, and when we think of "new user retention," our ideas are invariably clouded to some degree by those reasons, which may be perfectly good but not the full story. A new user that vanishes is one more user that can't help us fix the problem.

If you have indeed stuck to your guns then you're probably not even still around to read this, but I hope that you will. I think you and your friends may get more out of this website that you think, despite the impression you seem to have gotten from this thread; please feel free to bug me on AIM whenever you like (my user name is in my profile), or just PM me if you don't have AIM, or whatever, and we can discuss this some more.

[Sagequeen]

I can give you the perspective of a newcomer, and also a RP newbie in general.

Upon joining the site, I was given no welcome PM. Even an automated one would be great -- with helpful links, names of currently active players I can PM for help, etc. This was a little off-putting.

As mentioned in previous threads, the information I needed to start (rules and canon) is fragmented across several threads and sometimes buried, sometimes changed. I'm not great with forum searches, but that was my only friend. There was conflicting information including different versions of maps. I like to immerse myself in a world either I or someone else has built and this makes it difficult. (But I am very determined and did my best. I like a challenge and I find I am even MORE creative when I have to consider a canon like an obstacle course. Also, when I see a canon-friendly thread, I know I can integrate myself more easily.)

I'll be honest: this would have been enough to make me leave except for a few things:

1) Judging. I welcome it! Writer's Workshop, the rubric, the whole thing, YES! I want to be a better writer. I want to entertain someone besides myself when I write.

2) I'm going to beat a dead horse here, but (I hope) it's relevant in that it's a reason I as a new person chose to stay here. Unless this is going to turn into a whole lot of solo threads or thread cliques, then having the most basic thing like land, history, and current events in common is great and should be encouraged so two perfect strangers can RP with a starting place. Even a new and veteran player have these things in common. I like continuity! I want to play a game with others while I improve my writing skills. Just make a new region, name it Dreamlands, and remove the grading system for continuity there outside of character continuity. Give players' profiles an area in which they can outline the worlds they build in Dreamlands so others who want to join have basic knowledge. Then players make the choice of canon or no canon and are graded accordingly. In all honesty I would eat that dead horse before I saw writers of such quality as those above leave the community over continuity. But, please take what I say with a grain of salt. I know how I think it would work in my mind, but often practical use turns out differently.

I know this post is all over the place, but I've got a 4-year-old and a puppy buzzing in my ear and at my feet. :D

Anyway - Althanas offers promise of what I really want in an RP site. I'm sticking around and I'll push through whatever difficulties I come across to be a part of it.

Edit: Please don't think me insensitive to the amount of work there is for only two mods. I understand! I wish I could help in some way though I am new to both RP and Althanas.

[orphans]

You're right, the divide between new users and old is a tricky one here. Part of the problem, I think, is that this is a self-sustaining issue: namely, if we have poor retention of new users, then we don't have new users to ask why they didn't stick around. ;) All of us oldies found various reasons that we stuck around, and when we think of "new user retention," our ideas are invariably clouded to some degree by those reasons, which may be perfectly good but not the full story. A new user that vanishes is one more user that can't help us fix the problem.

:D.... I disappeared for 3 years for no reason and came back last year....

To the topic at hand though, I think Sagequeen has a good suggestion in that an automated welcome message that links to the FAQ or other helpful things would be nice.

Might be a little strange for those making an alternate character, but even then, they might find something useful too.

And... that's all I have.

[Jack Frost]

Why do I always miss all of the fun discussion stuff?

Here's some stuff I want:
A freakin automated Spell checker on site, that can spell check with half the shit we've added to our vocab. Thayne and Underwood are the only two "Althy Words" I've written with that spell check okays. It bugs me because I see red and back track to check.

I agree to the easier flow of Information. I'm trying to research elves and all I've got is a vague history and such. Revamp it Por favor! I'm so serious I swapped languages.

I want a puppy, I wanna be level ten. I also want to be on the top 100 list because there are really thirty active members. We need more active members. What happened to Sei being to greeting committee?

[Duffy]

Try Google Chrome, Jack.

It has a spell checker built into the browser, though it'll take a while to acclimatise to all the non-words used on Althanas.

That's if you don't have Microsoft Office, of course. I'm an Office 2010 Whore myself :D

[Elrundir]

Why do I always miss all of the fun discussion stuff?

Here's some stuff I want:
A freakin automated Spell checker on site, that can spell check with half the shit we've added to our vocab. Thayne and Underwood are the only two "Althy Words" I've written with that spell check okays. It bugs me because I see red and back track to check.

I agree to the easier flow of Information. I'm trying to research elves and all I've got is a vague history and such. Revamp it Por favor! I'm so serious I swapped languages.

I want a puppy, I wanna be level ten. I also want to be on the top 100 list because there are really thirty active members. We need more active members. What happened to Sei being to greeting committee?

Silly billy, you can add those Althy words to your Word dictionary and it won't mark them incorrect anymore. And it'll even tell you when you've misspelled them to boot!

As for the elves, once again, check out the wiki page for Raiaera that I linked above. I'd say the page is just about complete now. It doesn't have anything on elves in terms of biology, if that's what you're looking for, but lots of info about the region and a link to their history (which isn't complete yet, but is at least good enough to bring you up to the Featured Quest). :)

[Visla Eraclaire]

People seriously type posts into their browser instead of into a word processor?

Pretty bold when the internet eats two hours worth of writing...

[Jack Frost]

Vislas back!
And I have had four hours of post eaten away by a power shutdown. Twas not pretty.

[Silence Sei]

What happened to Sei being to greeting committee?

Judging and actually posting in threads I owe to people became a priority I will probably bring back my greeting PMs now though...

[Duffy]

Do we not get a welcome e-mail when we register?

[SirArtemis]

People seriously type posts into their browser instead of into a word processor?

Pretty bold when the internet eats two hours worth of writing...

If this were a Facebook status, I would click the like button - and I almost NEVER like what Visla has to say =)

[Vigil]

People seriously type posts into their browser instead of into a word processor?

Pretty bold when the internet eats two hours worth of writing...

I copy and paste onto MS word and use it for editing only. Most of the writing and proofreading is done with posts. But yeah, I've had that problem a couple of times. Not that much was lost, ate some really bad posts before.

As for bold? Nothing ventured, nothing gained, I guess.


If this were a Facebook status, I would click the like button - and I almost NEVER like what Visla has to say =)

A backhanded comment from you. Jesus, when did you grow teeth?

[Max Dirks]

I've toyed with adding a spell checker to the site, but decided it wasn't worth it due to the size and the database strain caused by the feature. It would be one thing if we were typing two line opinions on new video games but because of the volume of writing on the site it's not worth the slow downs.

[SirArtemis]

A backhanded comment from you. Jesus, when did you grow teeth?

Born with a few ^^ Just enough to get by.

[SirArtemis]

A friend of mine, the new character that some of you may have noticed named Gale Silvers, just created an account. Granted, he had my help in figuring things out, but I sent him an e-mail with the following list. Maybe something like this could be used for greeting messages?

Getting started stuff to help make your profile (http://www.althanas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Getting_Started)


The leveling mechanisms (http://althanas.com/world/faq.php?faq=exp#faq_introexp)


The current draft of the world map (http://imgur.com/hd5oa)


The almanac with information on Regions (http://www.althanas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Regions)


Information about the Bazaar (shop mechanism) and tells about materials and qualities for when you figure your equipment out (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?22255-The-Bazaar-FAQ-Tier-List&highlight=most+realistic)


The althanas timeline (http://www.althanas.com/wiki/index.php?title=History)

--
Another history line. May be useful, though the above link is more up to date (http://althanas.com/world/faq.php?faq=roleplaying#faq_introhist)

[Rayse Valentino]

I really think centralization of information needs to happen sooner than later. When you register you're forced to go to a thread for anti-spam purposes, right? Why not put all that there.

[The International]

Really Rayse? Did you not see what Elrundir and I have had to repeatedly say over the last few pages?

We're... On... It

[Rayse Valentino]

http://i.imgur.com/kG7Qj.gif

Sorry, it's hard to tell whether or not there's progress being made or just nothing over the course of several years. You can't really play the victim card on a site with a proven track record of empty promises and forgotten projects.

I'm not interested in taking anyone's word for it. If I don't see a deadline, I assume it's just going to get ignored like almost every other possible improvement on this site. This isn't me being cynical, this is me being realistic. When 90% of promises are broken, you shouldn't be surprised when nobody trusts the words "We're on it".

[The International]

Upon joining the site, I was given no welcome PM. Even an automated one would be great -- with helpful links, names of currently active players I can PM for help, etc. This was a little off-putting.


Getting started stuff to help make your profile (http://www.althanas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Getting_Started)


The leveling mechanisms (http://althanas.com/world/faq.php?faq=exp#faq_introexp)


The current draft of the world map (http://imgur.com/hd5oa)


The almanac with information on Regions (http://www.althanas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Regions)


Information about the Bazaar (shop mechanism) and tells about materials and qualities for when you figure your equipment out (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?22255-The-Bazaar-FAQ-Tier-List&highlight=most+realistic)


The althanas timeline (http://www.althanas.com/wiki/index.php?title=History)

--
Another history line. May be useful, though the above link is more up to date (http://althanas.com/world/faq.php?faq=roleplaying#faq_introhist)


This is good. I'll see what we can do about it.

[Venessian]

New blood is great and everything. Keeps things fresh, yaddy yaddy...

BUT... The new people who really count are the ones who stick around and become old ones, right? I'd just like to suggest that maybe 85% retention isn't such a bad thing if 100 people join and 15 dedicated writers stay, weeding out regurgitated character ideas, fancies that people came up with all whimsical like, and let's face it, most of those characters are probably alts that get dropped by the wayside.

I was also wondering if any effort has been taken to contact previous members of althanas who have left due to displeasure with the site, or school, or whatever. If they didn't have time to RP because they had school for 3 years, well, if they left in 2008... see what Im saying?

If people can't be bothered to learn the rules, get used to the ideas in play, and become active in what is UNDENIABLY its own living, breathing community, and population is a current concern, why not give a friendly email to old friends?

"Hey, there's new stuff going on. You might like it. Why not re-register your character and see what's new? Or make a new one. We're all working real hard, and your participation would (like it once did) make Althanas awesome."

If those people left because they were on bad terms with current members, then maybe a proverbial burying of the hatchet might be in order to see to Althanas' best interests?

What's with the obsession of trying to over-populate a world that's difficult enough to maintain as it is? Its not like a creative writing forum will ever be a pay site. What's to gain by having 3678937459 active members?

[SirArtemis]

I was also wondering if any effort has been taken to contact previous members of althanas who have left due to displeasure with the site, or school, or whatever. If they didn't have time to RP because they had school for 3 years, well, if they left in 2008... see what I'm saying?

If people can't be bothered to learn the rules, get used to the ideas in play, and become active in what is UNDENIABLY its own living, breathing community, and population is a current concern, why not give a friendly email to old friends?

"Hey, there's new stuff going on. You might like it. Why not re-register your character and see what's new? Or make a new one. We're all working real hard, and your participation would (like it once did) make Althanas awesome."

If those people left because they were on bad terms with current members, then maybe a proverbial burying of the hatchet might be in order to see to Althanas' best interests?

What's with the obsession of trying to over-populate a world that's difficult enough to maintain as it is? Its not like a creative writing forum will ever be a pay site. What's to gain by having 3678937459 active members?

I highlighted the two parts I like.

One: it's likely not going to be any fun to be a judge if you do a thread a day. There's a burn-out period for everyone, including staff.
Two: Old members might be a good idea to target, especially with personalized messages. My only concern is if they don't check their e-mail and won't receive the PM's, but it's worth a shot.

[Silence Sei]

I used to try to convince oldbies to come back all the time, but either they're too busy with work, or they keep telling me they'll post and never do.

I just sort of gave up on that route.

[SirArtemis]

I used to try to convince oldbies to come back all the time, but either they're too busy with work, or they keep telling me they'll post and never do.

I just sort of gave up on that route.

Yeah, I can understand that. But hey, it's good that you try and maybe it'd be nice to check in with them every once in a while like you did, even if they don't end up joining. It might be worth it to at least plant the idea in their mind as a refresher.

[Atzar]

New blood is great and everything. Keeps things fresh, yaddy yaddy...

BUT... The new people who really count are the ones who stick around and become old ones, right? I'd just like to suggest that maybe 85% retention isn't such a bad thing if 100 people join and 15 dedicated writers stay, weeding out regurgitated character ideas, fancies that people came up with all whimsical like, and let's face it, most of those characters are probably alts that get dropped by the wayside.

I was also wondering if any effort has been taken to contact previous members of althanas who have left due to displeasure with the site, or school, or whatever. If they didn't have time to RP because they had school for 3 years, well, if they left in 2008... see what Im saying?

If people can't be bothered to learn the rules, get used to the ideas in play, and become active in what is UNDENIABLY its own living, breathing community, and population is a current concern, why not give a friendly email to old friends?

"Hey, there's new stuff going on. You might like it. Why not re-register your character and see what's new? Or make a new one. We're all working real hard, and your participation would (like it once did) make Althanas awesome."

If those people left because they were on bad terms with current members, then maybe a proverbial burying of the hatchet might be in order to see to Althanas' best interests?

What's with the obsession of trying to over-populate a world that's difficult enough to maintain as it is? Its not like a creative writing forum will ever be a pay site. What's to gain by having 3678937459 active members?

More good writers, more diversity, more ideas, more potential leaders for the site as it heads into the future.

It's not like the current staff would be required to handle the demands of 3678937459 members all by itself. Hire more mods if the workload becomes too much for the current staff - an increase in activity will also bring more potential moderators.

It's also not like this site is anywhere close to being overpopulated. It only just sustains all of its regions as it is. Althanas' known regions are shown as just a corner of the entire planet, so I'd hope that the ultimate goal is to expand beyond the horizons you've set. If the site really takes off to the point where Althanas as we know it is overloaded, then open an entirely new setting. There are always ways to cope with an increase in activity.

Now, I understand that you probably didn't mean what you said as literally as that. I acknowledge and agree with your main point that we should seek out old blood as well as new blood. I just don't see this as an 'either-or' problem - recruit both!



Also, who are the GM's right now?

[Duffy]

I've always wondered what it'd be like to have a welcome page, then two sub-pages...

The Althanas as we know it...

And an Althanas of the future, say, 10,000 years or so...

Duffy as a steampunk sci-fi badass? Yes please!

[Elrundir]

Also, who are the GM's right now?
If you mean what I think you mean, which is CMs (Canon Masters), then right now they are The International and myself.

[The International]

I've always wondered what it'd be like to have a welcome page, then two sub-pages...

The Althanas as we know it...

And an Althanas of the future, say, 10,000 years or so...

Duffy as a steampunk sci-fi badass? Yes please!

We do have a steampunk setting, Alerar

[Atzar]

If you mean what I think you mean, which is CMs (Canon Masters), then right now they are The International and myself.


I ask because I'm assuming you guys intend to start "canon threads" (for lack of a better term off the top of my head) sometime in the near future. (Off-topic: I fully support naming them fuses. Canon thread? Cannon thread? See what I did there?) I'd suggest recruiting for them now - seeing what people want to see and where, gauging interest for your own ideas and generally just keeping people involved with the process as it happens.

Not only would it make the product better by increasing input (though the final decision is yours, of course), it would improve your turnout as well. I’d be a lot more likely to join if I felt like I had a personal say in the creation of the thread. Also, I’d be more likely to join if I talked to you regularly and you asked me to join, as opposed to just contacting me out of the blue or relying on me to notice and take interest by myself. Peons aren’t good at doing things by themselves – not useful things, at least. They need direction.

This wouldn’t even have to be something you do yourself. Delegate it. Find a lackey and assign them the task of mingling with us commonfolk, keeping us updated, gathering opinions and tossing out the bad ones before letting you know what’s up.

tl;dr: get to know your peeplz!

Anyway, I’ll stop telling you how to do your job now. Just a suggestion.

[Duffy]

Ermm...

Corone War Atzar, there's about 6 canon threads ongoing at the moment :).

Oh, and Alerar HAS NO LAZERS!

[Atzar]

Ermm...

Corone War Atzar, there's about 6 canon threads ongoing at the moment :).

Oh, and Alerar HAS NO LAZERS!

I know. The rock I live under has teh internetz. I know more or less what's going on.

I was talking about future projects, not so much projects that are already in action.

[Zook Murnig]

I fully back the idea of these "fuses." And the name works, too. These threads could act as the flashpoints of action in each region, hearkening back to the MQs of the Featured Quest, like Arms of Gold (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?11100-MQ-Arms-of-Gold&highlight=). Set storylines for large scale quests, and decision points along the way to direct the story on a number of set paths. We could even offer greater rewards for participation and completion of a fuse, either directly tied to the goals of the quest as an item, or a free enchantment, or even just bonus XP and gold. I keep seeing this AP system mentioned in various places around the board, so this might even be a way to get AP, whatever that is.

And Duffy, I think if you're looking for lasers, you want cyberpunk.

EDIT: Also, has anyone other than me done anything with our TV Tropes entry (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Althanas)?

[Atzar]

I fully back the idea of these "fuses." And the name works, too. These threads could act as the flashpoints of action in each region, hearkening back to the MQs of the Featured Quest, like Arms of Gold (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?11100-MQ-Arms-of-Gold&highlight=). Set storylines for large scale quests, and decision points along the way to direct the story on a number of set paths. We could even offer greater rewards for participation and completion of a fuse, either directly tied to the goals of the quest as an item, or a free enchantment, or even just bonus XP and gold. I keep seeing this AP system mentioned in various places around the board, so this might even be a way to get AP, whatever that is.

And Duffy, I think if you're looking for lasers, you want cyberpunk.

EDIT: Also, has anyone other than me done anything with our TV Tropes entry (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Althanas)?

That's pretty much what they do. It's not the fuses themselves that are such an original idea - these have been in the works ever since the start of the transition to Althanas 3.0, and to my knowledge they work basically just as you suggested they should. I'm asking them to hype the things, not just by opening another thread asking people to join, but on an individual basis. I can miss/ignore a recruitment thread for a fuse that I hadn't heard of previously. It's hard to miss a PM in my inbox or an IM on my computer screen, and it's hard to ignore when it comes from somebody I like and talk to fairly often, and it's also hard to ignore if they've kept me updated on the process - especially if they've involved me in it personally.

[Elrundir]

I don't know what AP is either, but these quests (which officially have the much less clever name of "CM Quests") will indeed be starting fairly soon. I've got several ideas already, but I'm just waiting for certain other things to finish up first for me personally so that I can devote myself to them a little more safely. Plus I kind of want the wiki to be up to speed by the time all of that stuff starts happening. Not sure exactly when recruitment will start, but it certainly won't be a secret, I can tell you that much at least.

[Letho]

That's pretty much what they do. It's not the fuses themselves that are such an original idea - these have been in the works ever since the start of the transition to Althanas 3.0, and to my knowledge they work basically just as you suggested they should. I'm asking them to hype the things, not just by opening another thread asking people to join, but on an individual basis. I can miss/ignore a recruitment thread for a fuse that I hadn't heard of previously. It's hard to miss a PM in my inbox or an IM on my computer screen, and it's hard to ignore when it comes from somebody I like and talk to fairly often, and it's also hard to ignore if they've kept me updated on the process - especially if they've involved me in it personally.I don't see how this system you propose would be fair to everybody and work without extremely burdening the CMs. Because if you're contacting only certain people about the threads, asking them to join, you're discriminating and playing favorites. And if you try to contact everybody, you need people who will slave in front of the screen for hours, trying to contract all the peeplz and then writing quests with them. As it stands, with posted recruitments, the offer is out in the open for everybody to see, show interest in and apply. Perhaps it doesn't have a personal touch, but it does give everybody a chance to take part (even though in the end it still boils down to the CMs choice).

[Atzar]

I'll probably get accused of beating a dead horse again, but so be it.

Letho, in one of my previous posts I suggested that this task wouldn't have to fall on the CM:


This wouldn’t even have to be something you do yourself. Delegate it. Find a lackey and assign them the task of mingling with us commonfolk, keeping us updated, gathering opinions and tossing out the bad ones before letting you know what’s up.

I'm talking about contacting everybody, but I'm certainly not suggesting that the 'lackey' write with everybody. That's absurd. When you're online, check the "Who's Online" page and add all of the AIM/Yahoo/whatever usernames to your contact list. Strike up a conversation when possible, and do the same with the rest via PM. That shouldn't take more than a couple of hours per week.

This could be a useful position on staff even without directly tying it to the CM's shenanigans. It was mentioned by Sagequeen earlier in this thread that the lack of a 'welcome PM' was offputting - this would be a good substitute/complement to that. Put Artemis's list of links in a 'welcome PM' and then have your Public Relations mod follow up to see if they have any additional questions and alert them to any major happenings on Althanas at the time.

Back to the original point, that would keep the load off of the CM, who certainly has enough to do. But it's enough work for a legitimately important moderator position without overburdening anybody. There would have to be some collaboration between PR mod, the CM and the Features mod, but I'm sure you guys could figure that out.

[The International]

Put Artemis's list of links in a 'welcome PM'

You actually read my mind concerning that.

As for the delegation, I think we need to be responsible enough to keep connected with you guys ourselves instead of hiring someone just to make you feel like we're paying attention. Regarding the fuse concept...


Set storylines for large scale quests, and decision points along the way to direct the story on a number of set paths.

...eh so so. We're working on the policy of the CM and we're trying to learn from the mistakes of our past. Right now we've pretty much confirmed that however many threads a CM can directly involve themselves in and see through at once is how many that CM is going to do. We also want to take into consideration how much the active population can handle, and the Civil War's Mission Board indicates to me that we put out a little too much. Mind you, I like the progress of the Civil War so far, and I have confidence (knock on wood) that this situation will be seen through and we'll have a clear winner in the end. Maybe, one day, when we generate enough activity and have enough dependable CMs to do it, we may have a huge scale FQ again, but for now we need to start small when compared to our previous endeavors and scale up as we go along. (By scale I mean OOC, not IC. We can still play out massive wars, but through a manageable number of threads.)

BUT WHILE WE'RE ON THE SUBJECT!
We've got ALL two of the site's CMs watching this thread. We already have ideas of what we'd like to do with our CM Quests, but we'd like some more. I'm sure you guys have some. Let's hear it.

[Atzar]

What sorts of ideas are you looking for? Ideas for the concept itself? Or ideas for storylines?

[The International]

I was hoping for storylines. I just got a really good one about Salvar over AIM. It just got me liking that region again.

[Mistletien]

I'm reviving this because I believe this thread had a good purpose. Still has, if others pick up too.
Bring back the Pagoda. I think this is the first step towards a crucial problem that Althanas has; member retention. Bringing back the Pagoda will (hopefully) mean more activity, and more activity means more people will become actually interested in staying here. One suggestion, though; make it bigger. Bolder. Like the Citadel; something of such importance that it become a permanent fixture. Maybe even make a FQ about it, hell if I know. But this is my suggestion, so take it with your grain of salt.

[Vigil]

I remember when i suggested this and talking to different moderators and members about implementing it again. To advocate it, I even went so far as to apply to help manage it. However, while the reception of it was positive, it was said that at the time this wasn't the direction the site should go in, so the idea was dropped. Or at the very least put on ice.

I bring this up because I'm noticing a pattern whenever we get into discussions like this, especially about member retention. People voice ideas on how to help the site, somebody offers more to it and eventually somebody begins to developing it. An example of this would be the member-ran tournament that The Architect tried to get going that had a prize purse that was completely funded by all the participants. Another idea was the use of the Active Players Union to act as a member advocate group to promote activity within the site and help give voice to growing concerns at the time. Both of these movements never really went any where because either the people running it vanished or members themselves were hesitant to invest in it. I suppose if you want to look back even further, you could look at member created material that has largely affected the site. Ithermoss's Book of Thayne and that pantheon has been fully integrated in the site and people have used it to supplement their work for years, even after he left. Another movement was the Red Hand and their little coup detat on the Bazaar and seizing control of it. People still talk about that and more then one power group has tried to embody that unique moment in Althanian history.

However, lets go to something more recent. With the Writing Settings thread where people were looking to garner activity for the site. More then a few people came up with ideas in a discussion to try and implement some sense of free-writing within the site. Maybe even allow peer reviews over judgments to experiment what it would be like for members to give critiques instead of the staff. I came up with A Leap Forward (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?24458-A-Leap-Forward-An-Althanas-Free-Writing-Initiative)as a member initiative to implement those features at a member level instead of just sitting around and talking about it. What's happened since then? Well, a few people joined, a lot of promises were made to write things and put things up, but only one person has actually done so and successfully received any sort of constructive criticism at all. And this isn't for a lack of interest, because I've gone out of my way to talk to people and see if they are interested in participating in this. A lot of people were and the reception was positive. To make sure the word got out, I've advertised it in threads, had Silence Sei form an announcement (http://www.althanas.com/world/announcement.php?f=309) over it and tried to get the word out. Because, like it or not, any ideas for some sort of member-facilitated movement have a very short half-life within the first couple weeks of being implemented. They either work, people get into it and through activity it is promoted and that movement grows. Or, more often then not, it doesn't get much activity, people eventually forget about it and like now for instance are turning to new ideas to help promote activity on the site.

Instead of A Leap Forward moving however, a lot of those same people who wanted to be involved, members or not, have given the general impression that they want to see it be successful before they have any investment in it at all. A similar problem that has been experienced in the examples I've given above, in tournaments, official and nonofficial contests meant to promote activity. I'm just at a loss here to keep seeing this pattern recreate itself.

Both the member base and the staff want this site to be successful and for it to be active, and potentially for some for it to return to the way it was years ago when it was very active. Back prior to that decay in activity, you could probably throw a rock in any direction and hit a member who was writing something. Not right now. More or less a lot of the ideas that are coming from numerous members to help promote some kind of Althanian Renissance never really follow through with it. I'm starting to agree with the notion that the only way for this site to be active is for the member base to be active and the idea of championing a single cause to help promote growth or activity in the site is a bit of a pipe dream.

If anybody wants this site to be more active and to work, then it should really begin with just writing threads and moving on from there. I sound like a bit of a hypocrite because I haven't been doing so since posting this and I am leaving for a month in a couple days, but it doesn't make it any less true. If anybody wants Althanas to be successful and live up to the reputation its cultivated over a decade ago, then I suggest instead of sitting back and waiting for things to happen then to take active hand in it. Do something and quit waiting for others to provide it for you. This complacency and playing 'wait and see' is really what is becoming detrimental to a lot of these grass roots movements or even staff-driven effort to keep the site active.

[Letho]

Regarding the Settings thread and the effects of that discussion, I took most of what was said in consideration and presented a plan in the mods forum for a new section of the site specifically geared towards free writing. It's currently waiting for someone with powers to set up the forums, and it generally incorporates a lot of ideas that were mentioned in the Settings thread. It's really a simple setup, nothing fancy, and hopefully it would be something that people would use and grow fond of. But with two of our admins quitting recently and only Max left with both powers and knowledge to set the forums up, it's currently stuck until someone can do the brickwork. So yeah, just wanted to say that the staff isn't deaf, just a bit slow to get rolling sometimes. :P

[Hysteria]

I'm just at a loss here to keep seeing this pattern recreate itself.

There has been a lot of research into innovation (or product/new technology) uptake within populations. The innovators or 'first group' will jump onto any new idea as soon as they see it. This actually accounts for only a small proportion of the total uptake should a new idea become popular. The difficultly is in pushing past the first small and dedicated group and getting it out into the wider population. What we often have is a new idea being created, taken up by the people who always take up new things and then never heard of again.

Althanas is unique, in that should someone choose to act within this 'reality', they must do it with other people. If not another RPer, then at least the judge(s). The whole board is linked to group activities and as such a group mentality. In life you can compartmentalize your actions, and do things that would be considered solitary. In that way you can express your true beliefs without fear of continually sticking to the norm. In Althanas, you have to do it with other people.

So, to draw this out into a practical application with A Leap Forward. Did you set something up to encourage those interested to RP with each other? Did you create an incentive to RP (group acceptance, open praise, fun)? Did you communication the goals and method of the group to those interested? I know you did some, but others maybe not.

If we apply this to logic to the Thayne Codex, what was the goal? 'Create useful cannon for others to use' What was the method? 'post it and get feedback'. How do people get involved? 'Read it, use it and post feedback'. And so on.

What we have is a simple, clear message that the group, regardless of the age, style, or who they RP with can apply. Someone using the codex doesn't need to RP with someone else using it because it is their character is their own. A Leap Forward requires a much more commitment from two or more people before it can even approach critical mass.

I might throw out a few suggestions that I think will help an idea get taken up:
1. Simple.
Simple to use, simple to understand, simple to explain.

2. Uptake by respected 'leaders'.
Although we might not necessary realise, or want to realise, there are influential RPers and no so. Sei, Letho, Jasmine, Duffy, EI, etc are names that spring to my mind of people who I will take note of when they start to do something or refer to something. When they get on board and start doing it, it helps tremendously.

3. Try and work out a reward system.
The depth and breath of the rewards are very important. If the reward is too specific then your uptake will be limited to smaller amounts of people. If it is too broad and not specific enough then you will have people favor your competition. To use a Leap Forward again, your reward is freedom of RPing, its competition is exp and character advancement, more people to RP with, and so on. For the Thayne Codex, the reward for using it is deeper plot-lines, ease of character furthering and fun, the reward for not using it? Very little.

EDIT:
The original work (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diffusion_of_innovations#Rogers.E2.80.99_5_Factors ) suggested these factors for uptake:

Relative Advantage
How improved an innovation is over the previous generation.

Compatibility
The level of compatibility that an innovation has to be assimilated into an individual’s life.

Complexity or Simplicity
If the innovation is perceived as complicated or difficult to use, an individual is unlikely to adopt it.

Trialability
How easily an innovation may be experimented. If a user is able to test an innovation, the individual will be more likely to adopt it.

Observability
The extent that an innovation is visible to others. An innovation that is more visible will drive communication among the individual’s peers and personal networks and will in turn create more positive or negative reactions.

[Vigil]

Or, more simply, if there is an idea that is genuinely liked or felt to be positive for the site's benefit, regardless of who presents it, it'd be in the interest of the member base seeking to generate activity to actually participate in it. Rather then waiting and watching for others to do so, which in many of the examples I've given, not just ALF has been the case. If you want something to thrive, especially a website that has slowly been declining in activity for the last couple of years, perhaps it'd be best to act first rather then wait and see how it turns out before you dip your toe in. The latter cautious approach might serve people very well if you're investing in some sort of business, but this is just a hobby.

Though if there is an official approach to free-writing, I suppose we can all stand to wait until year's end for it to be created and implemented. Not when something is already available and free to use. What would be the rationale in that?