Serenti Q/A

[Chosen of the Gods]

Figured it was a good time to open up the Q/A thread since Registration is now closed!

I have one question at this time, and that's

Can we know ahead of time who our first round opponents are?

I ask because I like to talk with my opponent about the flow of the battle ahead of time. Also it will help slow starts and awkward shuffling of feet in the beginning. If this is possible, i would love it, but if not, well, I understand that too.

[Breaker]

Yes... as soon as the list of participants is finalised (not everybody has a 3.0 approved profile yet) I will generate and post the bracket. There will be time between that and the first round start to contact your opponent for planning/deciding who posts first.

Also, thanks for making this.

[Chosen of the Gods]

Awesome! Glad to hear that. Can we also use this thread to just keep stuff up to date?

[SirArtemis]

When you make the bracket, can you please just randomize who makes the first post? Or do you want the two to decide on that? I feel like it should be randomized and then the writers can decide on their own if they want to trump that, but need permission.

[Knave]

Barring any change of the rules, its a first come first go kind of thing, Artemis. You can work things out with your opponent if you choose. There is a very real reason for why that is, and its not a pleasant one.

[Breaker]

Often enough, there will be one person who really wants to write the first post, and one person who doesn't care. If there's any disagreements, the respectful thing to do would be let the less powerful character create the setting.

[Christoph]

^-- What he said. I've frequently created battlefields or circumstances specifically to give under-leveled opponent's a fighting chance -- everything from having my character be weak or tired to making the battle a drunken temporal debate instead of combat.

[Dianus Ogham]

What happens when two alts from the same writer meet?

[Visla Eraclaire]

I would re-mix that pairing to the extent possible. Now, if Duffy ends up being the two finalists, then it's unavoidable, but what're the odds?

[Dianus Ogham]

If I entered with another 12 characters I'd take that bet...

I'd have another mental break down mind :(.

[Silence Sei]

Or you know, you could just post once with the character you want leading up to the finals, and leaving the other to the wayside.

:P

[Mordelain]

I want Ruby AND Blank in the finals...I'm torn, I really am :(.

[Silence Sei]

Then bring your A game, Duffster.

[Grandjester]

Can we start now? I'm way too hyped. :P

[orphans]

I have to help my mother pick peaches :/

people wonder where I get the randomness for stuff, well, tada?

Agenda for me today:
Pick peaches
Pick herbs
Pick miscellaneous vegetables
Pick raspberries
Get buckets of water
Shoo the chipmunks away
Shoo the rabbits away
Avoid/spray the woodchuck

and no, my mother doesn't live on a farm.

:D

[Vigil]

I have to help my mother pick peaches :/

people wonder where I get the randomness for stuff, well, tada?

Agenda for me today:
Pick peaches
Pick herbs
Pick miscellaneous vegetables
Pick raspberries
Get buckets of water
Shoo the chipmunks away
Shoo the rabbits away
Avoid/spray the woodchuck

and no, my mother doesn't live on a farm.

:D

A .22 could solve at least three of those problems.

[Duffy]

Going to Tesco could solve three more :).

P.S, when will the pairings be announced?

[Elrundir]

That will just be waiting on everyone to get their profiles 3.0-approved. There are still a couple of hangers-on who haven't done so, I think, so if they haven't at least posted their profiles for approval by the deadline, the bracket will be generated without them and Numbers will put it up for us.

[Shadar]

What are the in-character details on this? I assume it's run by the Ai'Brone (like Google, they run everything) and maaaybe in the Citadel.

[Knave]

There isn't much of an actual in-story presence in the competition. It was suggested that we make some story and setting, but that was likely vetoed because it would favor one player over another in reasons to be in a place and reasons to fight at all.

I asked around, but the largest detail I've heard is that some nobles put up a tournament. That was pretty much it. The odd part is that in the original description, the tournament is one of the oldest and best known tournaments. Ultimately, it can be whatever you like, and this is for the best as not all characters have a reason to engage in a large series of death matches on what could be considered the other side of Althanas.

[BlackAndBlueEyes]

I have a serious question, and if I seem rude then I apologize in advance.

Who, who, who in their right mind decided that the time limit for every round was going to be one week?

I have a job that's full time plus. I have other obligations outside of that, as well. I'm sure that I'm not the only one here.

I signed up under the presumption that there'd be a reasonable time limit for every round. You have to take into consideration that school is starting back up for a few of the other participants (I imagine, anyway). There will be conflicts, and there will be days that posts cannot be made.

This one week business? It's ridiculous. I'm just speaking for myself here, but during the seven days you currently have allotted, I will be out of town and away from my computer for four.

For the sake of actual participation, and for the fun of writing in the tournament, I petition that the time limit be extended to two weeks.

[Ruby]

Which would extend the tournament into the 3 month time line category...

[Christoph]

So? Battles would actually finish. The whole point of a tournament is to have fun AND put forth the best effort possible, not to rush out posts just to meet a ridiculous time limit. I agree 100% with BaBE on this. I would have posted about it first, but he noticed before me.

[Silence Sei]

Actually, as I was an original advocate, thinking about it, a week sounds plenty fair.

Think about it, all you're required to do is post 5 times, minimum, for seven days. That leaves two days to rest on your laurels.

I don't think thats too bad an idea now, actually.

[Letho]

I think one week per round is usual for Serenti. I know for a fact that in the one where I got to the finals (2005 I believe) the rounds also lasted one week. So suck it up and get to writing.

EDIT: Hell, The Cell rounds were two weeks long, and there's a whole lot more action in them than in a one-on-one battle. Remember, you had to post every 24 hours in the Cell or you got kicked out. And the majority had no problem with that. In fact, it was one of the smoothest tournaments I remember on Althanas.

[Christoph]

Except with the Cell, there were always people to respond to, so posting quickly was actually -easier- than in a 1v1. Seven days may sound reasonable on paper, as Sei described, but it leaves no contingencies for issues like BaBE expressed. It makes the tournament a contest of "who can devote the most time out of their lives to Althanas". Also, not everyone can whip up a post in an hour, and even fewer can write a -good- post in that amount of time. But I already made this point in my previous post.

The bottom line: the initial rules and regulations said nothing about a shorter time-limit, so most people likely entered under the assumption of two-week rounds. Heck, the rules even went on to say that a player would only lose a Wildcard point if they took over 48 hours to reply, which reinforced that assumption. And now that everyone is registered and Althanas gets an awesome turnout for the event, the round time-limit is revealed to be... one week. Seriously, Althanas?

[Vigil]

Suck it up? Easy for you to say, Braveheart.

A lot of us have busy schedules to attend to. I'm under evaluation, I have classes, homework, work, studying, mentoring and 5-8 new people I have to keep after for the time being. I'm not saying I'm more important. I'm saying I'm busy. And before you tell me I should've considered this before I even joined the competition, perhaps I would have if it was labeled in the rules prior to registration that rounds would be of short length and at a 1 week period. For something that hasn't been around in years, you make a lot of assumptions in believing that all of us retain the same knowledge of traditions in these tournaments such as 1 week round lengths. All that was mentioned was a 5-7 day rest period to give judges time to evaluate the battles.

Here are the rules;


I. Registration
Registration for the Serenti is probably the simplest out of all the tournaments. Just post a reply in the registration thread with the word “Registered” included in it somewhere. The registration for the Serenti will last for a week and multiple characters are allowed in the tournament. There is a 32 player minimum, but everyone interested will be allowed to participate in this tournament.
II. Rules
a) Only registered players will be allowed to participate in this tournament. If your character has not been approved you will not be allowed to join.
b) The battles will run exactly like a Citadel battle where each fighter will be completely healed afterwards. Between each round there will be a 5-7 day rest period for judgments and updates to be posted around Althanas.
c) The first person to post will establish the setting for the battle.
d) The standard rules of battle of Althanas also apply for the duration of this tournament. This means no power gaming will be tolerated and OOC should be kept to a minimum.
e) Players who do not post in their battle will be disqualified from the tournament. EXP and Gold will only be awarded to those battles that reach 10 posts of actual RP.
III. Judgments
a) All threads will be judged as battles. The player with the highest score will advance to the next round. All judgments are FINAL.
b) Any time a player takes more than 48 hours to respond to their opponent's last post they will have 1 point deducted from their Wildcard score.
IV. Rewards
The Rewards for the Serenti are basic, but substantial. In every round other than the first and last, all battles over 10 posts will be awarded a 5% boost to their EXP gain. The winner of the tournament will receive 5000 EXP, the second place winner will receive 2500 EXP and the third place winner will receive 2000 EXP.

Really? Again. No round length was mentioned here.

Why should a judge get the amount of time it takes us to compete to read and judge a battle? So they aren't rushed? Especially when it can be done in one sitting if the assumption is being made that the average battle is going to be at a 10 post minimum, if they want to continue competing of course.

I understand the need to shore up round lengths in order to shorten the tournament's duration because tournaments tend to drag out a lot and interest wanes very quickly, but this should've been planned and discussed by those running the tournament about its design before it was even put into action. As it stands, these 1 week lengths were established, I'm guessing, also by the same guy running and participating it, but also left the staff and his post running the tournament TODAY;


Newsflash - Numbers Guy has resigned from staff, so someone else will be handling the tournament. Am'aleh be praised.

FROM; News- August 23rd, 2011 (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?23366-News-August-23rd-2011&p=189264&viewfull=1#post189264)

I think before moderators start defending actions made of the tournament, the issue needs to be addressed of the tournament's management turning and bolting before this even got off the ground. Numbers has his own reasons for leaving, and those are not the issue here. I am saying that perhaps time needs to be taken to re-evaluate the next step after a critical member of the tournament's management has left, before you send it and all of us who registered careening into the first round. Actions he has taken designing this tournament need to be assessed and weighed because he is no longer there to manage the tournament.

EDIT: After reading my post, I checked the match-ups. There are 21 battles about to occur. 210 posts of varying lengths at a minimum will be posted, If every battle finishes and wants to qualify for a judgment. Most of this consists of judges or staff members who are also participating in the tournament. I would argue an ethical dilemma if it is decided that there is a substantial backlog and not enough people to keep up with it that those participating need to intervene, but since the person who used to run it is also participating, I guess the point is moot.

How many people have been left to judge?

Before you start getting hardnosed with people, Letho, perhaps some more forethought over this should have been considered. And should especially be considered now, before having somebody else inherit what could become a potential disaster and a repeat of the ToC.

[Jasmine]

Woah woah woah!! Everybody calm down!!! This is under discussion and I'm doing the best I can with it. Despite the turmoil Numbers has caused, we're getting it under control. So everybody just calm down and be patient while we get things sorted out. Thank you.

[Letho]

@Vigil

Yes, that was very easy for me to say. Because apparently I have nothing else to do but hang around on Althanas. Well, yes, there's the full time job which sometimes has me on the road from 5am to 6pm, but hey, let's just stick to the assumptions and be happy with it, right?

I honestly don't have a true say in this matter. I'm not participating and I'm not a part of the features staff. I was trying to point out that this unthinkable 1 week round isn't really something new on Althanas and that there were times when people didn't bitch about it.

[Kryja]

Bickering does nothing to solve the issue. Right now, we need to look at it objectively and focus on what needs to be done, please.

[Atzar]

I honestly don't have a true say in this matter. I'm not participating and I'm not a part of the features staff. I was trying to point out that this unthinkable 1 week round isn't really something new on Althanas and that there were times when people didn't bitch about it.

There may have been times when people didn't bitch about time constraints, but there were also times when people knew about said constraints beforehand.

Just saying.

[The International]

I leave for three hours...

Anyways. I read the whole thread and saw that you guys were having issues with the one week round limit. I had always assumed one week myself, but I can understand where you guys are coming from. I for one have a hard time accepting two weeks for every round and one week break in between rounds. This would stretch out for way too long and we're trying to accommodate the activity trends of the site, but we need the week break to judge the threads. I had a chat with Christoph and he came up with a pretty good idea that would get the players their desired two weeks, and the judges time to do their thing. We'll break the bracket into two, stagger the rounds so that half of the players start this week and the other half will start next Saturday. If we keep everything staggered the tournament will end in a timely fashion and the starting judge wont be overwhelmed. It's likely that at least one judge will be eliminated during the first round of judging so things will be eased up almost immediately. Uneven matches and odd men out will be dealt with by wildcard matches. This way, contestants get their two weeks, Judges don't get overwhelmed, and the Tournament moves in a somewhat acceptable pace.

[Atzar]

Compromise?

Ten days. Requires you to post every other day. It's not like there's a written rule that says "The lengths of tournament rounds must be decided in one-week increments."

[The International]

The rounds will still be two weeks each.

I don't recall saying anything about ten days.

[Atzar]

Ignore my post. I didn't see your post before I put in the idea.

[Vigil]

I leave for three hours...

Anyways. I read the whole thread and saw that you guys were having issues with the one week round limit. I had always assumed one week myself, but I can understand where you guys are coming from. I for one have a hard time accepting two weeks for every round and one week break in between rounds. This would stretch out for way too long and we're trying to accommodate the activity trends of the site, but we need the week break to judge the threads. I had a chat with Christoph and he came up with a pretty good idea that would get the players their desired two weeks, and the judges time to do their thing. We'll break the bracket into two, stagger the rounds so that half of the players start this week and the other half will start next Saturday. If we keep everything staggered the tournament will end in a timely fashion and the starting judge wont be overwhelmed. It's likely that at least one judge will be eliminated during the first round of judging so things will be eased up almost immediately. Uneven matches and odd men out will be dealt with by wildcard matches. This way, contestants get their two weeks, Judges don't get overwhelmed, and the Tournament moves in a somewhat acceptable pace.

Sounds fair. I like it.

[SirArtemis]

What decides who gets put into which bracket for the staggering?

[Christoph]

I can only assume randomization, Arty.

[SirArtemis]

I can only assume randomization, Arty.

isn't that somewhat counter productive to the entire purpose of people complaining about the single week?

If you stagger, why not stagger deadlines for those who need it, so those who feel the need 2 weeks write for 2 weeks, and those who can submit within one week, do. Say that there is a bonus for those who finish before the 7 days, maybe another 5-10% exp bonus or whatever. It doesn't make a huge difference because if you write quickly and your writing sucks, you still don't get more exp than you would if you wrote well and took 2 weeks.

That way, people have their 2 weeks to write if they need it, and those that finish sooner get their exp reward if they feel they can make quality by then, and that allows judges to get a break up in it as well.

Staggering and randomizing just helps judges, not the writers complaining.

[Vigil]

Uhh.. It actually helps us a whole lot. I'll take sitting out for a week to give judges time to catch up in exchange for two weeks of getting skull-fucked instead of just one.

Yup. Two week rounds. I'll re-up on that shit every time.

[SirArtemis]

Uhh.. It actually helps us a whole lot. I'll take sitting out for a week to give judges time to catch up in exchange for two weeks of getting skull-fucked instead of just one.

Yup. Two week rounds. I'll re-up on that shit every time.

In theory, if it were staggered, and you got stuck with a due date in the first round, YOU still get just one week to post. If YOU need two weeks, and I NEED one week, what do we do if YOU get stuck with the first deadline and i do with the second?

From what I gather, it's 7 days to write. Then 7 days to judge. But I don't know if I'm missing something. If we stagger, it becomes 7 days for round one, 7 days for round two (which includes judging of round one), and 7 days for judging round 2.

Did I miss something, or does my point stand that those who NEED two weeks might still get shafted with the first week deadline.

That's why I suggest a mid-2-week deadline that comes with a bonus, and then judges can start judging those.

[Elrundir]

In theory, if it were staggered, and you got stuck with a due date in the first round, YOU still get just one week to post. If YOU need two weeks, and I NEED one week, what do we do if YOU get stuck with the first deadline and i do with the second?

From what I gather, it's 7 days to write. Then 7 days to judge. But I don't know if I'm missing something. If we stagger, it becomes 7 days for round one, 7 days for round two (which includes judging of round one), and 7 days for judging round 2.

Did I miss something, or does my point stand that those who NEED two weeks might still get shafted with the first week deadline.

That's why I suggest a mid-2-week deadline that comes with a bonus, and then judges can start judging those.
I think you might be misunderstanding what he means. Essentially, there will be a Round 1A and a Round 1B. Round 1A will start on (say) August 27 and their battles must finish by September 10. Round 1B will start on September 3 and their battles must finish by September 17. Both groups get two weeks to post, and the judges get a week in between to judge some battles.

[Silence Sei]

Artie, dude, you are seriously misinterpretting whats going on. Both staggers are going to be 2 weeks each. IF you finish sooner, submit it and it will be judged. The only thing that has change, lets put it this way

Section A has 11 of the 21 battles

Section B has the following 10

Now Section A starts on Saturday, the 27th, but Section B starts on Sept 3rd. While Section B is starting, we will be in the second week of battling for Section A. During Section B's -second- week of battling is when we'll be judging everything left in section A. Section A will start again the following week and Section B gets judged during that. So on and so forth.

Understand? God I hoped I explained that well.

Ninja'd by an elf. Damn.

[SirArtemis]

Okay so instead of staggering as in 7 days for round A and 7 days for round B, you're doing 14 days for round A and B and making them overlap for the middle 7. That makes fighting 3 weeks and 1 week for final judgments for round B. That means 1 month per round, all in all.

Got that now, right?

[Amber Eyes]

Closer....
basically it will work like this.

Week 1- Group A starts

Week 2- Group A finishes and Group B Starts

Week 3- Group A is judged and Group B finishes

Week4- Group A second round starts and group B is judged

and so on and so on.

[Christoph]

I think you're still not quite understanding. The tournament will move faster because there won't be any downtime, and since it spreads out the judging workload, we can expect fewer delays on that front. All in all, it will make things run much more smoothly.

[Ruby]

I'm withdrawing.

*with all three entries.

[SirArtemis]

I'm withdrawing.

*with all three entries.

um. why?

[Ruby]

With the new round length the duration of the tournament potentially stretches it until Christmas.

I do not wish to tie my activity up for such an extreme duration.

Nothing malicious to it.

[Max Dirks]

Bro, I don't think you understand.

At maximum, the tournament will last 11 weeks. That's two months, early November at most.

[Rayse Valentino]

Check your math, Dirksy old boy.

ROUND 1: 39 = 19 matches and 1 bye.
ROUND 2: 20 = 10 matches.
ROUND 3: 10 = 5 matches.
ROUND 4: 5 = 2 matches with 1 bye.
ROUND 5: 3 = 1 match with 1 bye.
ROUND 6: 2 = 1 match.

Alternatively,

http://www.printyourbrackets.com/pdfbrackets/39teamsingle.pdf

ROUND 1: 39 = 14 matches with 11 byes (this eliminates the excess 7 people).
ROUND 2: 32 = 16 matches.
ROUND 3: 16 = 8 matches.
ROUND 4: 8 = 4 matches.
ROUND 5: 4 = 2 matches.
ROUND 6: 2 = 1 match.

In both cases that's 6 rounds, at 2 weeks each that's 12 weeks.

Add in an extra week per round for judging and that's 18 weeks.

Add in the last week for the staggered groups to merge (Group A will have to wait at the end for Group B to be finished and judged) and that's 19 weeks.

I mean, my math may be wrong here, but that's pretty harsh. Even at Ro16 you give judges only one day to get it done, you're only shaving off about 4 weeks, which leaves you at 14. (not counting the last round's judging as part of the tournament)

[Ruby]

My reservations are not simply to do with the extended round time.

It was changed, off the back of...2, 3 comments. There are another 20 or so competitors, probably 15 or so actual people (to account for alts and so forth).

Instead of consulting the general majority, it was simply changed.

Don't get me wrong, I understand that people have work commitments and lives, but on the other hand, extending the tournament to this duration now effects my life.

Rather than change the entire tournament or kick up a fuss, and knowing that my mental health and work load are going to increase during November, it is more polite for me to withdraw before the tournament begins. This allows the organiser to re-arrange or make alternative arrangement to make up for the loss of three participants.

I know from speaking to others that I am not alone in the dissapointment this brings.

I hope consideration will be given to the outcome of the tournament and any issues which arise.

If it really does cause that much of a fuss, I will remain as a sole competitor with Ruby. Otherwise, best of luck to everyone taking part!

[Zook Murnig]

I'm not trying to be antagonizing, but keep in mind that you were the one who decided to sign up with as many characters as you did. After having made a big deal about needing to drop threads and put threads off for later because the level of activity you were forcing on yourself was driving you insane. This is exactly why I only signed up with my main, despite wanting to use my new characters.

EDIT: And more on topic, while I agree with the new organization of the tournament, with two brackets staggered until either the end or a more manageable level of participation is reached, Duffy has a point. It was brought up by no more than three people, argued against by two or three, and then suddenly changed. In a tournament that's already got some ethics problems going on, no less. I understand that this is the internet, and ethics are not exactly high priority, but keep in mind that the moment someone has a problem, ethics is about the only thing that'll keep the site from shutting down.

All due respect to Numbers and the rest of the mods who signed up, I understand the desire to participate in something that you worked so hard to create and make as awesome as possible. However, someone needs to work on it. If the moment everything's finished getting set up, and all the matches are decided, the guy who did all the work jumps in as a participant, that's an ethics issue. Christoph, I'm sure, remembers when I called foul on him participating in the Dajas Pagoda while he was running it. The problem arises that it can look, from a pessimist's point of view, like the system was set up, or is being actively used, to that person's advantage.

Moderation and running features like this isn't just about devoting a bunch of time to something a lot of people to enjoy. You also have to keep in mind that once it's set up, you need to stand back and let others enjoy it. It's a sacrifice, and it takes a certain type of person to be completely okay with it. Honestly, the only example I can come up with from this site where anyone has stood back and watched, working entirely behind the scenes and keeping things straight, was Serilliant. Dirks is doing a damn good job of keeping impartial and ethical, but he's also playing Ceidon from time to time, and I don't blame him. It's a great site, and as small as our current memberbase is, we need as many people playing on it as possible to keep it running.

I guess what I'm saying, in the end, is that everything looks like a shitpile to the guy who gets screwed. And that guy is gonna start screaming at the top of his lungs, trying to get whatever he can out of it, or trying to bring everything down, if there's even one decision made without consideration for how it looks from the outside. I trust that everyone involved here is on the up-and-up, and that's saying something coming from me, but to the people who don't like the decision, it doesn't look that way.

[Elrundir]

Regarding the ethics issue, I'm not sure I understand. Numbers' resignation had nothing (as far as I know) to do with any sort of desire to participate in the tournament. Since the outcome of any tournament is ultimately decided by the judges, the real ethical dilemma would be if anyone who participated in the tournament were to judge it--but that's absolutely not happening. Even those judges who participate and get eliminated will not be judging subsequent rounds. I understand what you mean about facilitators of a feature not participating in it, I'm just not sure I understand where the concern is coming from in this case. (That's an honest question; I'd like to know.)

[Max Dirks]

I want to step in and clarify something.

The decision to extend tournament rounds to two weeks had absolutely nothing to do with this thread or any dissent herein. Before the first person griped about it in this thread, I had already informed the features moderators that rounds would be two weeks long. This, if you want to call it such, was an infamous unilateral Dirks move. It comes with the typical take it or leave it attitude as well. Duffy's already used the door. I wouldn't mind a free pass to the finals either.

However, the decision was not made out of a vacuum. I have organized the most tournaments on Althanas, mind you. We've had a lot of folks come out of the woodwork for this tournament. Since they left, the quality (and therefore the pressure) has increased tremendously. To prevent washouts, I want to give people plenty of time to make high quality posts. I don't know about Sei, but reading the same tournament battle (though with different characters and different setting) gets incredibly tedious too. Making the rounds longer will increase the variety of battles. Also, the last time we enforced strict posting rules (ala the Cell), there was NO ACTIVITY ANYWHERE ELSE ON ALTHANAS DURING THE TOURNAMENT! You've got two weeks to complete tournament battles. In between posts, why not finish that solo quest or boss battle you've been working on? Actively writing will probably make your tournament posts better too. Finally, the hype of this tournament is about to expire. I'd rather give players the ability to post at their own pace than burn out before round one finishes.

Whatever, if Duffy wants out I don't care (and Rayse, I'm pretty sure it's 5 staggered rounds, so my math is probably closer than yours). Duffy's spots will just be auto-victories to those who do want to participate and make an opening post.

[Rayse Valentino]

(and Rayse, I'm pretty sure it's 5 staggered rounds, so my math is probably closer than yours)

My math is on the table. Where's yours? Unless you're planning to eliminate the outlier when you get down to 5 somehow, it's 6 rounds.

edit: You probably just forgot the judging grace period.

You know what? I don't care. Duffy knows what's up so that's good enough for me. I wash my hands of this entire matter and won't reply anymore.

[BlackAndBlueEyes]

extend tournament rounds to two weeks had absolutely nothing to do with this thread or any dissent herein. Before the first person griped about it in this thread, I had already informed the features moderators that rounds would be two weeks long.

If this was the case, then shouldn't Numbers' thread have been edited to reflect that, thus sparing us this whole mess that I caused?

Because, as of the time I posted this reply, it hasn't...

[Vigil]

Regarding the ethics issue, I'm not sure I understand. Numbers' resignation had nothing (as far as I know) to do with any sort of desire to participate in the tournament. Since the outcome of any tournament is ultimately decided by the judges, the real ethical dilemma would be if anyone who participated in the tournament were to judge it--but that's absolutely not happening. Even those judges who participate and get eliminated will not be judging subsequent rounds. I understand what you mean about facilitators of a feature not participating in it, I'm just not sure I understand where the concern is coming from in this case. (That's an honest question; I'd like to know.)

Considering people are arguing something I mentioned off the cuff earlier, I want to point out why I mentioned it because its starting to devolve into something stupid that had nothing to do with the problem. Numbers was facilitating the tournament. He also joined and decided to participate in it at the same time before he quit. I wasn't making the association that he quit in order to play, I was stating something unethical I noticed that was being done from the get go. And I was also raising the point about most of the judges/staff members participating in the tournament when I found out about the number of battles coming through. Which they can't judge afterwards because that would also be unethical.

The management playing in the pool was gravy. Lack of Judges versus a bombardment of over 200 posts in a week? That was the issue. That was why ethics was brought up.


My reservations are not simply to do with the extended round time.

It was changed, off the back of...2, 3 comments. There are another 20 or so competitors, probably 15 or so actual people (to account for alts and so forth).

Instead of consulting the general majority, it was simply changed.

Don't get me wrong, I understand that people have work commitments and lives, but on the other hand, extending the tournament to this duration now effects my life.

Rather than change the entire tournament or kick up a fuss, and knowing that my mental health and work load are going to increase during November, it is more polite for me to withdraw before the tournament begins. This allows the organiser to re-arrange or make alternative arrangement to make up for the loss of three participants.

I know from speaking to others that I am not alone in the dissapointment this brings.

I hope consideration will be given to the outcome of the tournament and any issues which arise.

If it really does cause that much of a fuss, I will remain as a sole competitor with Ruby. Otherwise, best of luck to everyone taking part!

I don't really understand your reasoning at all. You're involved in this with more then three accounts and prior to the change would have to be participating in three simultaneous battles and hope to write.. what.. a minimum of 15 posts in a week? And you're saying that an extension to the tournament to make it easier on some of us is bad for you? Seriously? I know you're infamous for being able to crank out threads faster then most people here, but do you really even realize what kind of demand you were putting on yourself and expecting to carry it on the back of whatever else you have going on? At that pace? Seriously?

[Christoph]

Duffy's spots will just be auto-victories to those who do want to participate and make an opening post.

That's silly. Duffy dropped out now specifically to allow the tournament staff a chance to adjust, thus avoiding THREE automatic inactive battles. At the very least, you guys could pair off two of the players left without opponents. I don't know about the other two, but I certainly don't want to sit on my hands for the entire first round.

[orphans]

That's silly. Duffy dropped out now specifically to allow the tournament staff a chance to adjust, thus avoiding THREE automatic inactive battles. At the very least, you guys could pair off two of the players left without opponents. I don't know about the other two, but I certainly don't want to sit on my hands for the entire first round.

Well, Duffy said that he might still stay in with just Ruby, and if that it is the case, whoever is match up with Ruby still has a match, and the two who no longer have matches could be together?

From a quick glance at the match list, Ruby will still be against Inkfinger, leaving Christoph and SirArtemis, no?

In the case that Ruby doesn't stay in, we could maybe open up the spot to one lucky person on a first come first serve basis? As I recall, there was someone who wanted to join, but because he was on vacation for a couple of days, he wasn't sure he could make it. Not sure if he's back now, but he might be interested in taking that place. Captain on the Wind, I think his user name was, registration was post 32 on the registration page.

[Visla Eraclaire]

My bet is looking strong.

[Atzar]

In light of the upcoming hurricane on the east coast of the US, I'd give some serious thought to changing the plan a little bit. It's extremely likely that several of the participants could be without power and unable to post within the 48-hour time limit over the weekend.

[SirArtemis]

In light of the upcoming hurricane on the east coast of the US, I'd give some serious thought to changing the plan a little bit. It's extremely likely that several of the participants could be without power and unable to post within the 48-hour time limit over the weekend.

If power really goes out, I am going to get SO much reading done. I've been WAITING for a good excuse.

[Chosen of the Gods]

My only question now is have we already separated everyone into brackets A and B yet?

[Venessian]

Well, I don't know about the rest of the people who seem to want to make this as complicated and difficult on the powers that be as possible, but here's my stance on the whole ordeal.

What should the brackets be: I don't care, I just want to do a tournament.

How long will the tournament take: I don't care, I just want to do a tournament.

Is the tournament biased: I don't care... (whatever. If your rps are better, you'll win)

Guys organizing this: Stop trying to take every single person's feelings into consideration. Once upon a time, administration said "there's a tournament. Sign up and try to win.

There were a lot fewer whiners back in the day. And seriously, if you're not actually on the staff that's planning the tournament, stop trying to help. No offense, but you're just slowing things down.

[Symbiosis]

FWA POW! In our face.

Though honestly, a point is made. If you can do it, do it, if you can't, well, oh well. It's a hobby, you make the time you can for it, and if you can't, it's okay...it's for fun. (Easier said than applied, I know, but seriously, this is getting a bit out of hand)

[BlackAndBlueEyes]

...and another thing!

This whole mess could've been prevented by a full disclosure of the rules ahead of time. Last I checked, the time limit for the round was not posted in the registration thread. Had everything been known ahead of time, us "whiners" who can't come home after a full day of work or school and shit out these amazing, JC-quality, thousand-word battle posts in the scant free time we have. Us "whiners" would've seen the posted time limit and said, "Oh, well, I don't have the time to compete in this at a level I would like. I guess I'll wait for the next tournament."

[Letho]

It was a procedural mistake if anything. I reckon that when Numbers organized the entire thing, he planned to run it the way Serenti has been run before, meaning one week rounds. To which Max reacted as he mentioned and it was changed practically the same day. Should it have been made clear at the registration how long the rounds would be? Probably. But both the one-week people and two-week people jumped readily to their own conclusion when they registered. And of 40+ people who registered, nobody really bothered to ask. So maybe, just maybe, the part of the blame is on you folks as well. Now, I think this dead horse has got enough beating already, but feel free to pound away.

[The International]

This whole mess could've been prevented by a full disclosure of the rules ahead of time.
There was a mistake and a misunderstanding. No one was trying to withhold any information from anyone else. The one that made the rounds one week quit. You made your complaint while the majority of us were at work or away from our computers. As we got to our computers we worked to find a solution for you, and as it turns out they were supposed to be two weeks in the first place. Now if you have any questions for the Q/A thread that would be nice.




EDIT: Ninja'd, but yea. This is a done deal.

[BlackAndBlueEyes]

I do have a question, actually.

As far as the actual match-ups go, will we be able to do more unconventional means of competition? Like, say, one of my battles in the Pagoda was a best-of tournament of carnival games. As long as it can be judged in a competitive way, am I good to go?

Or should I just stick with a more conventional battle setup for the sake of simplicity for the judge(s), who are pretty pressed for time?

[Elrundir]

I don't remember where I read it, but I'm pretty positive that you can in fact do that.

[Atzar]

Apologies to all involved, but I'm withdrawing from the tournament. Apologies and a 'good luck' wish specifically to Symbiosis, who was to be my first battle.

You may choose to pair off the four participants who now have no first round opponent, if you prefer.