The Running Critique Thread

[Roc]

Hey all.

I just tossed up the first few posts of this thread (http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?24860-Fulcrum). I'm rusty, and I'd love to get some input on it. In exchange, post an in-progress thread of your own here and I'll return the favor. It's my hope that this can be one of those continuous threads that everybody uses for a long time. So feel free to speak up!

Typos are always nice to kill, and if you see any point them out and I will squash them like the bugs they are. I'm hope for some stylistic criticism, though. Did the story hook you? Do you feel like I hit you with too much information and not enough action? What do you think of the characters thus far (although it's probably a bit too early to make a judgment on that)? Also, is there anything I've done so far that you liked?

One thing I do ask is this - if you note a mistake, give me some idea of how to fix it. Vague statements like "I didn't like the pacing" don't really help me, because I don't know what you disliked about it and I don't know how to correct it.

Thanks!

[Sagequeen]

Hey there Roc. We love feedback here at Althanas, and have already made a section of the site where you and others can do just what you have suggested. It's called the Writer's Workshop (http://www.althanas.com/world/forumdisplay.php?263-The-Writers-Workshop). Check it out!

:)

[Roc]

I understand. The reason I put it here is because the Workshop seems to be for finished threads (correct me if I'm wrong). What I'm looking for here is some commentary while I'm in the process. I tend to make heavy edits as I write, especially in a solo thread like this one, and more opinions are always welcome.

I have no problem if you move it to the WW, though, if that's what you prefer.

[Sagequeen]

Yes, you're right. We're taking a look at the Writer's Workshop to see if it can be better utilized.

Just proceed here for the time being, and we'll move the thread if/when it becomes appropriate. Thanks!!!

[absentwizard]

[Post 1 Para 2] Confusion: How did we suddenly learn her name and non-visible traits? While we can infer from later in the passage that she is an acquaintance, the way that she is introduced does not prepare the reader for it. A simple edit of Para 1's last sentence to read "... the familiar visitor." would do the trick.

[Post 1 Para 4] Word Choice: Rhadriel is providing context, not summarizing.

[Post 1 Para 5] Confusion: I don't follow Rhadriel's argument. So far, I've inferred that the writer wants to provide or sell information on Tavus. The risk is obvious but the reward is dubious. What, exactly, does "We have enough business here without making unnecessary gambles." mean, since this doesn't seem to be a proposal for additional business? (i.e. hiring Roc)

[Post 1] Confusion: An unknown writer has, through Rhadriel, put in a note offering information on Tavus, whom Roc doesn't know of. Yet parts of the conversation is written as if the writer was offering to hire Roc instead. There is insufficient context to place why Roc would possibly be interested in Tavus.

[Post 2 Para 1-3] Missed Potential: There's no description of auditory, olfactory, or tactile senses. Your ability specifies all five senses. There could have been a lot more information.

[Post 3 Para 1] Oddity: The first sentence seems to imply that the only people that they met were off-duty guards. That is to say, they didn't meet any guards who were on-duty but who were still in the building. I found this odd considering that city guarding does not (usually) consist entirely of walking beats. There are offices, as you've noted.

[Post 3 Para 2] Timing: I concluded from Para 2 that they went immediately. It was past early afternoon at that time, or otherwise the sunlight wouldn't be slanting into his windows and piercing the pall of smoke. Yet here we have the captain eating his lunch. There is either a timing error or a lost opportunity to remark either "his usual late lunch" or "an unusually late lunch".

[Post 3] The words "keep this quiet" prefacing the revelation that there are undercover guards in the gangs implies that Georez thought that Roc needed telling in the first place. They've worked together before, so it casts some shadows on Roc's competence. It's a blindingly obvious thing that Roc should already know if he was to be trusted with the information in the first place.

[Post 4] Roc is trying to dismiss Rhadriel despite the fact that she is also in danger of being used as a hostage to get to Roc. I had formerly assumed that Georez's recommendation for Rhadriel to stay close is so that he can use the fewest number of men to protect both of them. This is either incompetence or callousness on Roc's part.

[Post 4 Para 9] A little too stiff and formal?

[Post 4 Para 15] How does Roc not notice the hot ash from the cigar falling on him, since he's oblivious? Is he in regular danger of setting himself on fire from the equivalent of smoking in bed?

[Post 4 Para 16] pried -> prised, perhaps? Where are the guards that the captain said he'll send?

[Post 5 Para 5] A club to the head is, in fact, a terrible way to knock someone out without causing permanent injury. You may consider a sap instead, but even that device is very dangerous and can cause concussions and permanent brain damage.

[Post 5 Para 5] The word "livery" means "uniform." What kind of uniform is this?

[Post 5 Para 9] Why is Tavus, presumably a competent strategist, wanting to be pitted against other power groups? War is not the goal. Control over the underworld is. War is simply one of many means to reach it.

[Post 5] Why is Tavus, presumably a competent employer, offering Roc all stick and no carrot?

[Post 5 Para 11-12] Judging by the thump, the door was barred, not locked.

[Post 6 Para 2] "The mists of early dawn" imply that early dawn usually has mists. As I understand it, these mists form when the colder ground cools warm air. This is unlikely to happen in a coastal town because in the early morning, a land breeze is blowing (as opposed to a sea breeze) and therefore there is no warm, moist air coming from the sea.

[Post 6 Para 6] Inconsistency: The first paragraphs set up that there are very few people out, yet on the main street there are enough people to make a throng that has to be dodged through. I can only imagine that during the full day, there are so many people on the main street that they're stacked two or three deep.

[Post 6 Para 6] Feral wolves do not imply that they are angry. In fact, the term "feral" doesn't usually apply to wolves because they're usually wild anyway. Dogs often aren't, hence "feral dog" is a meaningful term.

[Post 6] ... so where did the watch go? Is it just a case of incompetent guards?

[Post 6] Harming innocents? What kind of cartoonish villainy is this? "Oh no the police are coming after me for kidnapping someone, so I'm going to start injuring random other people"? If Tavus is actually powerful enough to hold the entire city hostage like that, then we're well past the point where the city guards matter.

[Post 7 Para 1] "more than she liked" -> "more often than she liked"

[Post 7 Para 4] Rhadriel ignored the smell of cigar smoke. Given whom she's tracking, that is possibly one of the best leads that she could follow. The smell and the ash is distinctive (esp. if she's familiar with what he smokes. See Holmes' treatise on types of cigar ash.).

[Post 8 Para 1] It can help the feeling if "his bed" was replaced with a reference to a strange bed, since he's explicitly not home right now.

[Post 8 Para 2-3] Either I fail to see how Roc is betraying anyone or fosaking any of his work, if he thinks that he can do more good or I fail to see how he thinks that a consolidated powerbase in the underworld can possibly be a net good. Either he's being traitorous because he's helping out the underworld overall, or he's not being traitorous because the underworld would be overall harmed by his help. The two causes of his internal conflict don't jive.

[Roc]

Lots of good stuff there. Thanks a lot. Hit me up if you ever want me to look over something of yours!

In general, several of the errors came about because of lack of experience with the character and unfamiliarity with writing in an urban setting and atmosphere. It's something I'll have to get used to.

Regarding Tavus: I didn't mean to imply that war is the only means of control that Tavus is looking to use. If I did say that, then I screwed up. Also, he's not employing Roc, exactly. This is very much a one-sided deal. Having said that, he'd prefer to have Roc simply cooperate, rather than forcing him (as shown by his reluctance to simply starve him into compliance).

Regarding Roc: your "all stick and no carrot" point is very true - Tavus is offering him little (yet) for his service. In a way, Roc is creating his own carrot by coming to the conclusion that Georez is inept and that working with Tavus may do more to bring the underworld under control.

I never meant to imply that Roc is incompetent. Instead, I'd use the word 'sheltered'. He works with Georez to bring in criminals that have no affiliation with any of the gangs. Because he has no noteworthy means of protecting himself, however, he's an easy mark for... well, people like Tavus who could use his abilities for their own purposes. Georez chose to keep him from the real threat instead of using him as an asset.

His conflict is almost entirely based on his reluctance to work with a criminal. He's a detective. He's supposed to be bringing these guys in, not helping them. However, he's beginning to realize how badly Georez has handled his job. It's occurring to him that he could probably do more to clean up the streets - even if it means working with Tavus - than he could if he 'stays clean' and only has access to the gang-disassociated stuff.

Regarding Georez: He's a coward. Plain and simple. For his part, he kept Roc out of the real underworld because it seemed to him like a favorable alternative to being proactive and using him to start shutting the underworld down. And as for the 'cartoonish villainy' bit, yes, Georez has lost control of the underworld. It's not solely Tavus as much as it is the combined force of all of the rings, though.

Think of the 'Vietnam War'. The Americans outmanned and outgunned the Vietcong but struggled in part because they had no idea who was friend or enemy. Georez might have the power at hand to restore order, but he's afraid of the collateral damage he might cause to uninvolved civilians by taking action. Like I said, he's a coward.



Overall, I think a lot of this stuff will be much clearer once I get an opportunity to go back through and make a lot of edits, especially to the dialogue (which admittedly I just crammed in there in most cases). I'm making an effort to edit a lot more heavily than I did when I used to write in the past. I used to nitpick myself and try to make everything perfect the first time, but I'd end up just turning it into a chore rather than a fun hobby. Now I'm trying to just write it out and worry about the finer points later. So far, it's working fairly well.


Do you have any general thoughts on the thread so far? Anything in particular that you like?