New Member Support Discussion

[Rayleigh]

Hello!

One of the biggest complaints about the site is that there is not enough support for new members. The site is an intimidating place, both due to the amount of lore, and the quality of writing. We are also a tightly-knit community, which can cause stress on newcomers. The challenge then becomes how we can counter that. How can we provide extra help for new members, to ease them into both the community and the world of Althanas?

There are a few different ideas floating around.

First, a mentor/mentee system. A team of established members will exist as mentors. They will welcome the newcomer, help them navigate the site, answer questions they have (to the best of their ability), and later, write with them. Mentors are not judges, and are not expected to help perfect the newcomer's writing. Instead, it is all about providing guidance, and aiding with the transition. There will be rewards for both the mentors and the mentees. If this idea is approved, we could have mentors who are assigned newcomers as soon as they show up, or a system where mentees seek out specific mentors. The specifics could be determined later!

Second, an Academy. A community I wrote in a few years ago had this, and it worked really well. Established members create "classes," that any member can take. Classes might be centered around character creation, development, setting, dialogue, mature themes, combat, etc. The "professor" will be tasked with creating assignments for and working closely with anyone who wishes to take their class. Members will "graduate" when the professor feels they have made significant progress. This is a cool idea, as anyone can take the classes - it benefits those who are new, and those who are not. More details could be hashed out at a later date, but the nice thing about this proposal is that writers can work on specific elements.

Feel free to vote for one, both, or neither. And please post your thoughts! I'm especially looking to hear from newcomers, or people who can remember how they felt back then, because that is at the heart of this whole discussion.

I would also love to hear from some more veteran members who might be willing to help out with either of these projects!

[FennWenn]

Hope my input is useful here! I guess I'm a funny case for a newcomer, since while I'm new to here, I'm not exactly new to roleplay forums like this in general. Personally, I've experienced mentor/mentee systems before, and they sometimes suffered from mentors that bit off more than they could chew. They were too absent and a lack of engagement caused their mentee(s) to get frustrated and leave. It's doubtful that would be a problem here, but it's something to keep in mind, maybe.

Now, this Academy is a new concept to me, but I like the idea. It'd take a lot of organization and work to pull off, it seems though.

Just in general, I'm supportive of trying out both systems. It'd be worth noting that neither of them might get much use until/unless we actually manage to attract people to the site though. Also throwing out the idea that we should fix up the wiki; a wiki that has accessible content can really help newbies out if they'd rather just lurk and learn things on their own for a bit. Accessible information and all that.

[Storm Veritas]

Ultimately, I voted Mentor/Mentee because if done correctly can work fantastically. It also doesn't require as much constant administration; a large pool of confirmed mentors could sign up as new mentees come around on a first come/first serve basis. This would ensure people signing up to mentor a newcomer are currently checking the sight, still willing to help, and interested in helping guide someone new.

My only fear with the Academy is that our track record for long term assignments relying on single individuals (See: Judging queues, realm of greeting approvals, bazaar approvals, tournament moderation, vignettes, splash page news feed generation, Lore cultivation, etc., etc., etc., etc., etc.) is really quite awful. It's not the fault of the staff, but rather the very nature of the work required. Thankless jobs like ALL of the aforementioned have a shelf life; people get sick of working hard in the shadows with no specific reward, incentive, or term in place.

If someone really good (like Ray, ;) ), wanted to run an Academy, then I would support it very strongly as long as there was a fixed term or finite window for it to operate. If it's left open-ended, I'm really concerned it would just become more cobwebs and abandoned threads within a month or two.

::Edited to add I'd be more than happy to help if I can in either venue::

[Sathyre]

I'll vote "both", but with a caveat: the site needs to become more user-friendly first, and not just in terms of guides and wiki info and in general things being hopefully put in one place, though that, too, would be very helpful. The issue I have with both of the suggestions, though I like both of them, is that mentor/mentee systems and academies and things like that - they look formal! They still look intimidating. They won't encourage most new people to jump in and play.

In this stage of the global roleplaying community's life, most people who will look for a roleplaying community are ones who have already had experiences with RP, whether it's forum RP, IM RP, or even fooling around in a chat with asterisks and ecksdees, which... isn't strictly roleplaying, but that's beside the point. They are the ones you need to work to convince the hardest - most communities out there are significantly more accessible. They are friendly and informal right from the get-go. They look casual, colorful, "jump-in-and-play" at its utmost, and that's what most users will be accustomed to, and that is what most users will want. Althanas' apparent focus on serious writing and bettering your skills is not encouraging for users who just want to have fun without being judged.

I've only recently unlurked. I've been very indecisive about joining, because the formality and seriousness of the site terrified me. ^^; It felt less like I would be heading in to have some friendly RP fun, and more like I would be writing as a job - that's the kind of atmosphere I picked up on. Walking into the chat made me a lot more comfortable, but most lurkers won't unlurk after this initial impression, unfortunately.

That's just my two cents, though. I've never managed a community, I just have opinions.

[redford]

I'll be honest here. I don't know much about whether one will work over the other, but I know I'm a success story of the mentor/mentee system. Logan and Fred were great and fun writers that got my feet wet in the lore, and taught me basically how to RP in general.

[FennWenn]

The issue I have with both of the suggestions, though I like both of them, is that mentor/mentee systems and academies and things like that - they look formal! They still look intimidating. They won't encourage most new people to jump in and play.

^Good point to note.

[Storm Veritas]

I'll vote "both", but with a caveat: the site needs to become more user-friendly first, and not just in terms of guides and wiki info and in general things being hopefully put in one place, though that, too, would be very helpful. The issue I have with both of the suggestions, though I like both of them, is that mentor/mentee systems and academies and things like that - they look formal! They still look intimidating. They won't encourage most new people to jump in and play.

In this stage of the global roleplaying community's life, most people who will look for a roleplaying community are ones who have already had experiences with RP, whether it's forum RP, IM RP, or even fooling around in a chat with asterisks and ecksdees, which... isn't strictly roleplaying, but that's beside the point. They are the ones you need to work to convince the hardest - most communities out there are significantly more accessible. They are friendly and informal right from the get-go. They look casual, colorful, "jump-in-and-play" at its utmost, and that's what most users will be accustomed to, and that is what most users will want. Althanas' apparent focus on serious writing and bettering your skills is not encouraging for users who just want to have fun without being judged.

I've only recently unlurked. I've been very indecisive about joining, because the formality and seriousness of the site terrified me. ^^; It felt less like I would be heading in to have some friendly RP fun, and more like I would be writing as a job - that's the kind of atmosphere I picked up on. Walking into the chat made me a lot more comfortable, but most lurkers won't unlurk after this initial impression, unfortunately.

That's just my two cents, though. I've never managed a community, I just have opinions.

Your feedback is incredibly important since you're new; thank you for offering your thoughts!

The original mission statement for Althanas was not one of creating a spot for people to RP, but rather served as a writing workshop geared to help writers develop. Of course, you do NOT need to submit anything for judgment, but in order to gain levels and make your character more powerful, that's a barrier that was intentionally put in place to encourage people to solicit feedback.

I'd expect (and could be wrong) that Althanas is okay with not being the right place for everyone, but I'd hope we could get everyone who likes to RP to give it a spin. How would you suggest the "intimidation" be scaled back without changing the overall mission?

[Sathyre]

Hmm. I don't have very concrete suggestions as to scaling back the intimidation factor of what Althanas aims to be, but I do suppose that it'd be helpful to emphasize that going for judgements is not something you absolutely have to do, in the guides and FAQs and generally where people won't have to dig for it and ask about it. More specifically, the "no judgement" option needs to be more apparent than it is right now.

In the Rules and Regulations/FAQ (http://www.althanas.com/world/faq.php), for example, the EXP/Levels section, which is one thing players will generally click on as one of the first things (everyone loves progress), really needs to be the part that has the full details about judgement types instead of said details being confined solely to the introduction section.

[Rayleigh]

Great thoughts, everyone. Thank you so much.

Just want to chime in on a few things. First, I do recognize the limited staff activity right now. These ideas haven't been approved (or even discussed) by staff - they're merely a couple of ideas I threw together. If we do opt for both or either, there will need to be a real chat about how much staff power should be set aside for it. We can downsize as necessary. However, this is a very, very real concern. This site has so many things going for it, but if we cannot keep members, we're killing ourselves. Not only that, new members deserve so much better than confusion and frustration.

Next, in regards to the purpose of the site. Storm, I do agree that the initial purpose of the site was to improve writing. I do not wish to alienate those who are here for that reason alone. But I think we are doing ourselves a disservice if we do not work to broaden that purpose. What harm is there in also welcoming those who wish to write for fun, and not for improvement? That's the entire reason I'm here, after all. We can help them find a place here without sacrificing the judging, the workshop, the tournaments, etc. We've made some steps that direction, such as making the Nexus more visible. Staff is also working hard to do more writing on our own, to foster this more laid-back, stress-free atmosphere. For as long as I've been here, there has been a space (although small) for people who just want to write. The no judgement description even states that it is for roleplayers. What the site should be is a big question to tackle, and the discussion can be on-going. But that is my personal stance.

Sathyre, my initial ideas for the mentor system are not formal at all. Consider a group of established members who reach out to newcomers. They introduce themselves via PM, they encourage them to join chat (which I fully believe is the best way to get involved), they answer any questions, the help with character development, and they even write with them. I am shooting for a more casual, more friendly way to transition into the community.

On the matter of things being confusing, I'll also want to direct you to the Guidelines and FAQ (http://www.althanas.com/world/forumdisplay.php?391-Guidelines-and-FAQs) forum. We've made strides in making these more visible, and while we still can make improvements, I think this is a really nice collection of help. While we could add the judgment types to the formal FAQ that you've linked to, I think that forum should be the go-to for most members. A mentor would be a great person to direct members to this forum.

Regarding taking emphasis off of judgments, I do agree with you. As mentioned previously, staff is working on finding some way to play up no judgments.

[Sathyre]

My suggestions are aimed less at making people who have already mustered the guts to join comfortable, and more at making people feel comfortable enough to join in the first place! That's to say, I'm speaking more from the position of a lurker-who-was-on-edge-of-registering-for-a-long-while, rather than a newbie-who-has-already-registered.

Also, while the guidelines and FAQ forum is helpful, as a newbie, one would naturally gravitate to the "rules and regulations" sticky, which is, coincidentally, where the formal FAQ is located. Rules and regulations are serious business, and you usually read those first, so that will inevitably continue causing confusion until things are arranged better, I think.

[Mari]

Ok, forgive me if this is jumbled I'm going to go over a few points.

I think before we look at mentors, or acadamies or anything of the sort, we need to look at the layout of the site. Not so much the RP forum parts - but the areas that contain crucial information.

Navigation
I'm not new to forum RP's, I've been doing them for 13 years; even so I found navigating Althanas difficult. Links were broken, hard to find, or just linked to seemingly outdated information.

The new user guide and FAQ section needs to be much more prominent on the home page. It needs to be obvious to newcomers. REALLY obvious. IT also needs to be worked on. A New User Guide should be able to reference to all areas and questions a user would have. I found nothing in there on.

What is there, is fantastic. It just needs elaboration and links. Links are a new users friend!

-Link to where the person needs to post.

You have a link to the update section and how to update a character, but not the initial area where people need to post character sheets, whilst this is generally obvious for people. IT's not for everyone.

-
AP
Ya'll need a guide on AP, I have been avoiding using mine because people keep telling me its hard to get, and I thought it was, then things started to be pointed out to me on how to get it, the best way to get it etc. etc. I don't see a proper guide for this anywhere. If we had a nice neat guide on AP that'd be fab, and if there is already one. Shove that link in the FAQ baby! Because that is most certainly a FAQ and most certainly is not in the 'new user guide and FAQ' section linked. here

http://www.althanas.com/world/showthread.php?26564



KNow what would be a good thing to make even more prominent? What shelby linked. I feel having that at the end of the spiel 'beginners guide to Althanas' would help - because then people would go

OH! THere's a whole section here!

The Wiki
What is canon? What isn't canon? I UNNO! I got told so many conflicting and confusing things, "The wiki is canon"
"Not all parts of the wiki are canon, only the canon approved things" Etc etc.

We need to overhaul that thing, add more description to the races, I know Fenn would agree with me there ;)
-----


I agree with a lot of users here, now - apparently I'm a decent Rper (Ya'll mad) And I found this hella intimidating at first. I think the consensus is it looks extremely formal and professional. Which is great. I mean, we wanna look like we know what we doing, but it's missing that friendly warmth that is so evident in the community.

IF we can somehow show that to new users, it'd make people feel less intimidated by the site and more willing to jump on in.

---

Final note; I say mentor system works well in my experience.

[Shinsou Vaan Osiris]

Some good, constructive discussion here. For the record I am a fan of both systems. The mentor / mentee system creates interpersonal relationships (OOC and IC) on top of the obvious benefits it provides to both staff and members. An academy helps to address specific topics and nuances and can be used to help any level of writer. I see merits in both.


AP
Ya'll need a guide on AP, I have been avoiding using mine because people keep telling me its hard to get, and I thought it was, then things started to be pointed out to me on how to get it, the best way to get it etc. etc. I don't see a proper guide for this anywhere. If we had a nice neat guide on AP that'd be fab, and if there is already one. Shove that link in the FAQ baby! Because that is most certainly a FAQ and most certainly is not in the 'new user guide and FAQ' section linked. here

Guide here, in the Guidelines and FAQS section (2nd thread down after the stickies) (http://www.althanas.com/world/forumdisplay.php?391-Guidelines-and-FAQs)

[Gadrial]

I am down to help out in anyway that can. Hell. I would even take part.

[Elthas_Belthasar]

I personally voted for both ideas.

I think anytime we can develop more of a kinship between staff and non-staff is a win for the community.

I can only speak for myself in this, but when I first joined Althanas, I didn't understand many of the original rules. The old rules were much harsher back then, and I think a mentor/mentee program has been a great boon to the site as a whole. I been on the site for a very long time and have been on staff at several points during my tenure (hahah tenure...) here. What I strongly recommend is to continue to develop the program that already exists and make it better, improve upon it.

Althanas is one of the few things that I am passionate about and I just want to someday bring my own kids (If I should ever have any) to this wonderful community of ours.

So anyway guys keep developing the program further and add more incentives/rewards for participation.

Let's make sure our newer writers feel more than welcome on the site!!!

~Pav