A proposed feature

[Reiko]

Althanas needs a feature that encourages member to actually help each other get better.

I have a proposed feature that would work as an apprenticeship program. Simply put the great members with some time would consider themselves to be masters and new members could become students. Masters and students would quest together or spar against each other. Now both masters and students could gain extra rewards for how they progress. Masters would get better rewards based on how helpful they are and students could gain bonus rewards for improvement.

It may sound silly but all of Althanas features tend to simply be chest beating activities that allow the great writers of Althanas to prove how great they are. This might make the JC forum something exciting to look at as improving members mean we won't just see the same people over and over.

[Seth_Rahl]

(IgnOre WEird lettERINg)

I aGree witH ReIKo'S IDEa. hElpinG MEMBers iMprOvE mIghT just BE WHAT This SiTE NeeDs. beSIDeS mOre sTAFfiNg. whaT'S thE poInT iN hAViNG nEw plaYERS SHOw up anD bE JUDGED upOn wHAt lIttLe sKIll THeY haVE IN tHeIr first few pOStS? I KNOw judges WOuld Argue that THE JUDGING itsElf should help members imPrOVe, But WHAt IF THaT isn'T The cAse?

i REST MY STAtemenT CAuse I knoW it huRTS TO reaD TheSE SenTAnCeS oF MinE. eek.

[Ataraxis]

Well it could be that after a while, the old members just like writing with other old members, since they've gotten to know each other and had found a matching pace? I mean, no one is immune to the comfort zone. Let's just not slap an elitist sticker on it just yet. I've seen many of the more experienced writers write with newer members, and lots of them jumping into recruiting threads. I mean, seriously, just look at them, and the names that show up in them. I think your system is already in place, just without the dangling-a-carrot-in-front-of-the-nose aspect.

But yeah, not to overload the mods more, a system similar to the Pagoda might be interesting. Similar, not in battling, paying gold and knocking people off and taking their places, but in experience people volunteering in a specific thread as 'teachers' or 'guides'. You'd be pretty much putting yourself at the disposal of any new member who wants to improve. They could choose a basic quest from a mission board, and the volunteer would start it as soon as possible.

The only difference is that the volunteer could put descriptive ooc notes at the end to explain what techniques they used and the such, and in their replies, they can say what was good and what was wrong in the new member's post. It's kind of an instant judgment quest, and in the end you would perhaps get the normal XP/GP scores, or you'd get those nifty OOC credits, or something else.

Thoughts?

[Thoracis]

Isn't this what the Pagoda was supposed to be?

[Slayer of the Rot]

Isn't this what judges do?

You know, suggesting to all members how to improve their style. While I'm guilty of complaining once and a while that I don't have a JC, well, too damn bad, which is why I don't do it anymore, unless I want to fuck with Manda.

Here's an idea; if you want to improve and get the JC you emphasis so much, listen to the judges and try new things to improve your writing abilities and style. We don't need another feature to clutter up the boards. Many are implemented, many are interested for a few months, and then the feature falls flat on it's ass.

[Thoracis]

Judge's Choice isn't something to shoot for anyway, really. A good majority of the of the people who would and could be considered the "best" on the site have never had, or had maybe one, Judge's Choice thread.

I think those threads are more or less catching the right judge at the right time. Not to say they don't deserve their spot, since most of them are considered by the entire staff before making it, but I bet there are a lot of threads that should be in there and a couple that wouldn't be in there if someone else judged it.

As far as judges go... they are helpful, but the amount of time it takes to give a truly in-depth judging and touch on every category in every thread is very time consuming and generally attempting to judge every thread like that is how judges get burned out. Still, I think it's fair to say that anyone who has been here for more then six months and/or had a few threads judged is probably better than when they started.

[Seth_Rahl]

(i have been throughly reprimanded lol)

I see Thoracis's point...i've never had a thread in the pagoda so i wouldn't know on that point, however. well, i just know even though i've had years of practice I can be a much better writer and rper, and sometimes I wished when i was newer that someone could hep me. But hey, if you say so...

[AdventWings]

Actually, I think Reiko has something going on there.

I've been looking around the Internet a bit and saw that on Alleria- *me ducks a flying rotten tomato thrown from a crowd of onlookers* Hey, chill out! :(

Anyways, as I was saying, over there- *Me dodges another rotten tomato* - they have this Peer Program where a well-experienced member helps around the New Kid to get to know the system Well, sure, Althanas could use that. But our system is nowhere near as complicated as the one over there.

*Waits to evade another rotten tomato, which apparently never came*

Althanas could do that, although there wouldn't be a need for any formal declaration or feature to be implemented. All that is required is for the older members contact and jump in to play with the newer members and give them advices where needed. I see Reiko already doing one example of it with Raimeiken, which is a good start.

In conclusion, I do not believe we need an OOC System to justify role-playing with the new kids. The Judges could give you guys more EXP for it, however, which will probably be discussed on later.

:)

[Eyes of...]

In my experience, as former SB mod and whatnot, the system would completely depend on the newer players. I've joined countless threads with people that couldn't write well, and when I offered to help them was given a rather rude and uptight version of the 'cold shoulder'.

You'd be surprised at the pride some people have. Personally, I've done this since I considered myself a good enough writer to start doing it. However, I don't want anything special for it. Nobody got anything when they started helping me pre-althanas.com...

While the notion is grand, and in theory good... I'm pretty sure people do it all the time. I see Pavel in a lot of threads with newer players, or letting them join his. He's a huge boon, like him or not, to the site. Personally, I love what he brings, and how much he cares.

Also, a lot of the vets and better writers that have been at it for a long time, like those of us from the old boards, are older. It is quite difficult for us to give up our own story lines and add more obligation threads to our limited time online. Personally, I play wow, have a full time and part time job, and try and get on Althanas when I can... amidst my real life friends and obligations.

[AdventWings]

Personally, I play wow, have a full time and part time job, and try and get on Althanas when I can...

Isn't this about time you give that WoW thing a rest? You know how badly MMORPGs consume your very soul. ;)

[Eyes of...]

Isn't this about time you give that WoW thing a rest? You know how badly MMORPGs consume your very soul. ;)

hahaha, yeah, probably. But it beats having to type out arguments on Althanas all day and night long... and at least when you do something on WoW you get somewhere, and don't have to wait a week for your fellow person to do their actions..

[Agent of Black]

Wait wait wait? So you're proposing that Althanas becomes a giant education institute?

To me, bringing official-ness to the status of "masters" and newcomers doesn't sound good. I think it happens enough as it is...


In conclusion, I do not believe we need an OOC System to justify role-playing with the new kids. The Judges could give you guys more EXP for it, however, which will probably be discussed on later.

I agree. Also personally, with the reference to "over there," i've been there, and I gotta tell you, Althanas is 10x more addicting. *someone random gives him an apple*

[Sorahn]

Actually... I'm pretty sure way back on on like... tanthanas... in the first iteration of the Dajas Pagoda there was a feature almost exactly like this. N00bs would get in a battle with pros (who signed up for this specific job) and all during the battle the pro would give the n00b tips on how they could phrase things better or generally improve their style.

While I can't comment on its effectiveness or even how many people used it because I was a n00b on tanthanas and never paid attention to the pagoda, I just thought I would mention it because it has been done before.

As far as JCs and stuff like that are concerned... I maintain a view that I really don't see a lot around here. Yes I try to write as well as I can, there was a point when I was so consumed with making my posts works of art that I actually lost the will to post. Finally I had to step back and think about it for a little while...

Yes this is a creative writing forum and everyone tries to improve, but at the heart of Althanas, it is a GAME. Games are supposed to be fun. If you become so absorbed with your writing that you're no longer having fun (like I did) then maybe you should re-evaluate some things.

I would much rather have someone write a bad post and have fun doing it then write an instant classic literary piece and almost shoot themselves in the process.

[Atzar]

I don't really know where this 'master' and 'new member' stuff is coming in. If you look around, you'll see that almost all of the people who fall under your 'master' label are already involved in several threads with 'new members'.

Frankly, I don't think this is a good idea. What you're proposing already happens for the people that want it, and won't for the people that don't. Those that are interested in improving their writing will ask for help or will look at other people's work to see what they do better. Those that are too proud for that sort of thing won't. It's that simple.

We get enough complaints about 'elitism' as it is. "You did a thread with another great writer, you're an elitist." Not so. When 'masters' write with each other, it almost never has to do with the skill or lack thereof of the other participants. Rather, it's because they know the person, they feel comfortable writing with them and - gasp - it's fun writing with friends!

[Eyes of...]

You know why this won't work? Hahaha, look at this: My suggestions (http://www.althanas.com/world/showpost.php?p=83707&postcount=5) made with the full intentions of assisting someone who cannot roleplay as well as others, no offense meant by that statement of course.

His response (http://www.althanas.com/world/showpost.php?p=83719&postcount=6) to my suggestions.

Now, I'm not sure what you were thinkin' about for this 'master' 'student' thing... but I'm pretty sure I've been on Althanas for almost 4 1/2 years, maybe 5. Been so long I can't remember. On top of that, I've been the Scara Brae mod, worked with tons of people the same way, and spent numerous threads not lookin' after my own welfare but the newer members that weren't writing well. Now, when I get something like this.... my bi-polar kicks in quite quickly.

Tell me, when you have members that do that, how are we supposed to help them? I'm not sure if I'm going to get an equally ----ed up response from sdwdrake, but figured I'd point this out to explain why I'm against it.

Thanks for your time.
Peace!

{{P.S. I edited my apologies into the OOC thread, but will not, under any circumstances, remove it. If it is deemed offensive, I'll probably laugh a bit... but a mod's going to have to take it down. Lol. Thanks again for your time.}}

[AdventWings]

Dang, that's a sharp jab below the ribs for all I know.

I'll leave the discussion to be dealt with in the OOC thread, though, not here. For the example, though, I'd have to say that's a PvP conflict of interest. It all comes down to personal preference in the end, but some stuff that's done could certainly be done differently to make the story believable. If I ever get around to judge that when it's done, I'll give out pointers like I usually do.

As for how you deal with this... well, if Peer Suggestions don't work, it's no longer your problem now. If your good intentions have been rejected (and I know how much it stings myself) all you can do is leave it up to the Judges to deal out the Judgment.

Thanks for helping them anyways, Eyes of/Osato. They'll see why soon enough. ;)

As to Sorahn's post: Aye, games are supposed to be fun. But then again, different people have different definitions of fun. For some people, it's beating the crap out of everything in their path regardless of direction. FPS Style. For others, RPGs with intricate stories are their cup of tea. And yet for others, a closely-matched duel is all that makes their day.

Althanas is a role-playing community with emphasis on improvement of writing in the English Language, but we also take on the concept of the "game" called RPG. There are many subgenres within the RPG group, from Tactical RPG (Like Front Mission series and La Pucelle: Tactics) to Hack 'n' Slash RPG (Or Dungeon Crawlers, like Diablo II or Gauntlets) and Story-Intenstive RPG (XenoSaga, formexample).

Therefore, you can choose what kind of fun you want.

He did bring up a valid point on the balance between Fun and Quality. While most of us here strive for Quality, sometimes we do need a step back from writing a great story and just kick it back with a mindless battle. I guess that's one reason why Althanas has the option of creating multiple characters for use, aye? :p

[Eyes of...]

He did bring up a valid point on the balance between Fun and Quality. While most of us here strive for Quality, sometimes we do need a step back from writing a great story and just kick it back with a mindless battle. I guess that's one reason why Althanas has the option of creating multiple characters for use, aye?

And for me, this is where Garwocket comes from... heh. Laid back, low stress, meaningless threads are almost more important to me than any others. Mainly because Althy's my anti-depressant, heh.

[Cyrus the virus]

If you weren't asked to put those suggestions in at the bottom of your post, you were out of line. Just thought I'd say so.