What the hell are we doing?

Okay, I've been thinking about this a lot lately, and I have to get it off my chest.

WHAT IN THE HOLY EVERLOVING SHIT ARE WE DOING ON ALTHANAS IT SEEMS LIKE ALL PEOPLE WANT IS GOLD AND EXP AND RANDOM SHIT WHEN WHAT WE SHOULD BE DOING IS WRITING DAMN GOOD STORIES AND NOT GIVING A RATS ASS WHO THINKS THEYRE GOOD OR IF WE GET A FIVE OR A FIFTY OR A FIVE HUNDRED IN THE SCORE AND WHETHER WE ADVANCE TO LEVEL ONE IN TWO DAYS OR TWO THOUSAND OR WHETHER WE ADVANCE AT ALL ITS ABOUT HOW WE TELL GOOD STORIES AND IF WE LIKE WHAT WE SAY EVEN IF SOME SELF-IMPORTANT POMPOUS JACKASS LIKE SIGHTER THINKS ITS GOOD OR NOT OH MY FUCKING GOD WERE SO INCREDIBLY STUPID.

Thanks. That helps.

I'm serious. Is Althanas about EXP, or is it about writing? Is it about what other people think of you? Have we just created the world's most inane clusterfuck and self-masturbatory mutual appreciation society?

Be honest. Are you here to have fun, or are you here to prove you're better than everyone else?

EDIT: And if you lie I'll know about it when I die and go to heaven, or maybe hell because you might know lots there too.

It's the tournaments' fault. having so many at once has an affect on the community.

I have been thunking that Althanas gets a bit too much into score but there's no way you can forget them. If you want a gunman character than you better damn well write a high score quest or you won't get that gun for your character to be a gunman. or magic swords and stuff. If you look at them in a way they're just props for your character to do what he does and yet there's junk like guns are too strong and it feels like only the high scorers get to have the characters they want while everyone else struggles to try to get what a character needs to fith their image.

I won't lie, the gamer in me wants to advance and get exp and become one of the "big guys" in this community and be a badass that some others can look forward to playing with. There is an enticing in that, for some reason. I blame MMORPG's. Or maybe my mother didn't hug me enough as child. Fuck if i know.

But more than that, I'm interested in seeing my character, the creation of my mind, is honestly able to interact with creations of other people's. I want to see his individual story interlap with others and create a whole new experience that I, myself, could have never imagined alone. That's what I'm truly hoping for, in the end. I dunno if my stories are any good, worth publishing or even giving a fucking gander at. Guess I don't care either. It's fun.

What about you, Siggy?

EDIT: Isn't "Self-masturbatory" kinda redundant? :D

I have a story for Seth, and I'm working towards it with every post. Occasionally I do things on the side, and occasionally I do care about score, since its tied to what rewards I can expect. The rewards are a means to an end in that I use them as plot devices. I don't think I've used to many, so I guess I gotta check and make sure I got them all I tink I remember a magic detecting charm...oh well. Point is I used to be all EXP whorish, now I just roleplay.

Hey, as long as we're ranting...

WHY THE FUCK IS IT THAT THE ONLY PEOPLE BITCHING ABOUT ALTHANAS BEING ALL ABOUT NUMBERS AND NOT ENOUGH ABOUT JUST STORIES ARE THE ONES WHO CAN PULL JC'S OUT OF THEIR ASSES AND GET CRITICAL ACCLAIM FOR EVERYTHING THEY WRITE???? AND WHY DONT THEY SEEM TO CARE ABOUT WHAT OTHER PEOPLE APPRECIATE ABOUT ALTHANAS!?!?

HEY IF THEY ONLY CARE ABOUT WRITING GOOD STORIES THEY CAN DO TO ANY OTHER SITE WHICH IS WHY ALTHANAS IS SO UNIQUE AND BELOVED FOR ITS INTERESTING LEVEL UP SYSTEM THAT IS NOT STUPID LIKE ALL THE OTHERS!!!

LOUD NOISES!!

I'm here for two reasons in no order. Firstly, I f*cking love roleplaying. Anyone who knows me back from the olden days or even just those who have spoken to me online at any stage know this and daren't not question my dedication when my activity is at its peak.

Secondly, I love writing. I love the idea I have the power to create anything I want, justify it and make it work.

Thirdly, (I know I said two but whatever), I want the opportunity to personally get revenge on certain ex-Castigar members for destroying my precious Red Dragon fortress. You assholes!!

I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE SCREAMING ABOUT!

Well, I'm writing for the fun of it for a large part - otherwise I wouldn't write about killing people...constantly...as gruesomely as possible...on a max 2nd post basis would I?

If I want to compete to check my competence as a writer I partake in a battle...but quests I write because I want to have fun and tell a story that's in my head, one that I'd like to share with others, if they like it or not. I try for myself to improve my writing, not for others.

OMG WHAT'S WITH ALL THE CAPS!

I'm on Althanas because I enjoy being on Althanas, when I stop enjoying it, you'll know, because I'll disappear again. I'm here because I love to write and because being here stimulates my creativity instead of letting it sit in a dormant place and rot. I do care about score, not becuase score awards me experience, personally I hate writing a fucking level up, but because my score lets me know how my writing is improving, how I can improve it and what I seem to be good at.

I'm here for the cookies. ^_^

OK, seriously, Master Raven is here to let us girls have fun. To hell with the EXP advances, writing's more fun than that!

Oh, that and the cool peeps. You guys.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sighter Tnailog

Okay, I've been thinking about this a lot lately, and I have to get it off my chest.

WHAT IN THE HOLY EVERLOVING SHIT ARE WE DOING ON ALTHANAS IT SEEMS LIKE ALL PEOPLE WANT IS GOLD AND EXP AND RANDOM SHIT WHEN WHAT WE SHOULD BE DOING IS WRITING DAMN GOOD STORIES AND NOT GIVING A RATS ASS WHO THINKS THEYRE GOOD OR IF WE GET A FIVE OR A FIFTY OR A FIVE HUNDRED IN THE SCORE AND WHETHER WE ADVANCE TO LEVEL ONE IN TWO DAYS OR TWO THOUSAND OR WHETHER WE ADVANCE AT ALL ITS ABOUT HOW WE TELL GOOD STORIES AND IF WE LIKE WHAT WE SAY EVEN IF SOME SELF-IMPORTANT POMPOUS JACKASS LIKE SIGHTER THINKS ITS GOOD OR NOT OH MY FUCKING GOD WERE SO INCREDIBLY STUPID.

Thanks. That helps.

I'm serious. Is Althanas about EXP, or is it about writing? Is it about what other people think of you? Have we just created the world's most inane clusterfuck and self-masturbatory mutual appreciation society?

Be honest. Are you here to have fun, or are you here to prove you're better than everyone else?

EDIT: And if you lie I'll know about it when I die and go to heaven, or maybe hell because you might know lots there too.

---

Quite frankly, I believe you've created a false dichotomy. According to you either love writing as this pure Platonic ideal or you're a mercenary for arbitrary numbers that have no value outside of this website. I think most of us fall somewhere in between. No matter what you do, you like to have some kind of positive reinforcement. Does this make us attention grubbing whores? Perhaps to some extent, but no more so than most aspects of life. Writing is a means of communication. I'd rather write on Althanas than on a notepad that I leave in my closet for some important non-EXP reasons.

1) I know somebody else read what I wrote.
2) I know what someone else thinks.

Does that make me a bad person. Perhaps. Does it make Althanas a mutual gratification society? Perhaps. Are these the worst things in the world, probably not.

Additionally, keep in mind that EXP is the measure of character progress and GP is the most effective way to obtain goods. I don't necessarily need ten tons of EXP per quest or a million GP, but I do like to get enough so that my skill sets can keep up with the stories.

Molotov hit the nail on the head it's both. I know I write for fun but I write on Althanas so people can see what I write, interact with what I write and I interact with what other people write. Things like EXP and Gold are rewards that make me feel good about what I write and that my writing is worth rewarding. Score’s are important to me because it’s what some one thinks about what I did and I know a low score really hurts and a high one feels good, these things keep out the lazy RPers that post one liners and really don’t care.

We do want to tell good stories but being Althanas is about rewards as well. Things like scores and EXP matter and can really hurt and help someone’s will to write. I know I often chime in when reward amounts change because I don’t want Althanas to cater only to those who are really good writers or write to the judges’ tastes and the score has a huge tilt that can be discouraging. I’ve learned to ignore JCs mostly because I don’ like reading most of them (there are some exceptions like Letho) and I have different tastes than most judges, maybe ‘cause I’m not a grammar nazi.

Um.....CARROTS!

Okay, anyway. I write for several reasons. I've loved roleplaying since I was eleven, and because Althanas lets me do it in detail and basically any circumstances I want, I love Althanas too. For another thing, Althanas itself is great to hang around. I think my writing has improved more during my time here than at any other point in my life, because I've been influenced by so many different styles of writing here, and there are so any amazing writers.

For another, I love coming up with characters and I love to write. It's a high that I don't think I'll ever want to give up, as cheesy as that sounds, and here, other people are the same way. Plus, y'all are fun to talk to. :)

But there's nothing wrong with wanting to gain more EXP. It's pa of the game that Althanas is fashioned to be, next to the bigger factor of a creative writing workshop, and a lot of people, including myself, like the idea that by going for a higher number, we can ultimately become better writers. The comments of judges, whether you think them true or not, are ultimately going to help us with our style, our plot, our grammar, whatever.

Therefore I don't think we write for one specific purpose. I think it's a bunch of combined things, but all pertain to improving your writing.

IS THIS JOKE DEAD YET???!?

Damnit...big Damon said it. Roleplaying is fun and we want some gratification for it, be it in spoils or numbers that say what someone thought about it.

I do it for the fun. And I really really really want a shotgun, lol :D

NO THIS JOKE WILL KEEP KICKING UNTIL YOU STRANGLE IT.

I write because I love to. And yes I care about my score. but not so I can get EXP and level (yeah I've been here this long and only just made it into the top 50 because of that crash...). I want my score so I know that it isn't just good writing because I think it is. I like knowing what someone else's critique of my writing is. so there.

WHO WANTS TO TOUCH MY PENIS

Really, I'm just here to improve myself, and considering how I was when I first came here, I think it's helped.

When I was a child, I dreamt of writing about a character on an (not yet created) internet message board that would be very powerful, and that I would have to spend countless hours wasting away while I progressed that character to that point.

I'm getting close to that boyhood goal, Madison, AND I'LL BE GOD-DAMNED IF YOU'RE GOING TO STOP ME!!!11

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyrus the virus

Hey, as long as we're ranting...

WHY THE FUCK IS IT THAT THE ONLY PEOPLE BITCHING ABOUT ALTHANAS BEING ALL ABOUT NUMBERS AND NOT ENOUGH ABOUT JUST STORIES ARE THE ONES WHO CAN PULL JC'S OUT OF THEIR ASSES AND GET CRITICAL ACCLAIM FOR EVERYTHING THEY WRITE???? AND WHY DONT THEY SEEM TO CARE ABOUT WHAT OTHER PEOPLE APPRECIATE ABOUT ALTHANAS!?!?

HEY IF THEY ONLY CARE ABOUT WRITING GOOD STORIES THEY CAN DO TO ANY OTHER SITE WHICH IS WHY ALTHANAS IS SO UNIQUE AND BELOVED FOR ITS INTERESTING LEVEL UP SYSTEM THAT IS NOT STUPID LIKE ALL THE OTHERS!!!

---

A funny sentiment from the person who beat me in the Serenti.

Also, if you talk to Santh, the reason Althanas is unique in this world is because of its rubric, not its level up system.

Quote:

---

Quite frankly, I believe you've created a false dichotomy. According to you either love writing as this pure Platonic ideal or you're a mercenary for arbitrary numbers that have no value outside of this website. I think most of us fall somewhere in between. No matter what you do, you like to have some kind of positive reinforcement. Does this make us attention grubbing whores? Perhaps to some extent, but no more so than most aspects of life. Writing is a means of communication. I'd rather write on Althanas than on a notepad that I leave in my closet for some important non-EXP reasons.

1) I know somebody else read what I wrote.
2) I know what someone else thinks.

Does that make me a bad person. Perhaps. Does it make Althanas a mutual gratification society? Perhaps. Are these the worst things in the world, probably not.

Additionally, keep in mind that EXP is the measure of character progress and GP is the most effective way to obtain goods. I don't necessarily need ten tons of EXP per quest or a million GP, but I do like to get enough so that my skill sets can keep up with the stories.

---

This is the kind of point I like to see made, because for the most part it's correct. My general thought is that Althanas should exist in some sort of creative tension between writing for writing's sake and writing for experience and character improvement.

I've just been noticing for some time now a trend on Althanas towards the idolization of the numbers over the writing. I run into people whose spirits are dashed when they don't get a Judge's Choice within three weeks of joining -- I was at level 6 before I got a Judge's Choice, regardless of Cyrus's opinions on my writing, which I take as a lovely compliment. Or I find people who are more concerned about getting onto the top ten EXP chart than on deserving of the honor.

My concern is at this point we are approaching a state where the numbers matter more than the philosophy behind them. That worries me. Althanas maybe shouldn't be a pure "Platonic ideal," but I can't see it hurting things if that's the model we STRIVE to emulate, or at least the model we keep on our minds as we go about our work here. While gaining rewards for the good things we do isn't a bad thing, and indeed is a great thing, shouldn't we aim a little bit higher?

If we all just wanted EXP and gold and other numbers that are virtually gratifying, we'd all be playing videogames intead of writing on a forum. Still, I think the desire for more EXP or gold overshadows, at times, a simple desire to write for its own sake. When it comes to roleplaying on a forum, though, one expects some reward or another for their time; progress in the fantasy world, character development, responses from other writers, etc.

Personally, I came here to write - I've had trouble just settling on the character with which I want my posts to revolve around, though. I roleplayed for about a year on a completely different forum: free-form, with no level-ups or restrictions on purchasing power. Frankly, it was awesome. What emerged was a dedicated set of community members that maintained equal character skills, but still allowed the writer to think of essentially anything that caught their imagination and develop their character in any direction along with the environment itself. Sure, powergamers and such came by every once in a while, but once they realized that their posts were not taken seriously, they either changed their style or left.

Coming from this background, I was a bit thrown off by this "level" system and a way to actually account for gold pieces. Since I am at the bottom of the barrel right now, I feel a sort of pressure to become an "EXP whore" and accumulate as much gold as I can. A desire to just write has become pushed to the side, partly, because my character isn't the true character I want - gold and EXP is the way to get him there. Until then, I don't feel as though I can fully enjoy my time here - rather foolish, yes, but it will just take some adjustment on my part.

Let's just pretend I threw in a funny phrase of capital letters.

My reason for being here is very simple. This is where all the fun people disappeared to :(

I couldn't convince them to come back, so I followed them instead. Great stories require great writers, and except for a few, everyone here, myself included, is mediocre. Some have talent, some have dedication, but everyone has flaws, and you'll never know what they are until someone better than you points them out, or gives you the vision to see them.

Does that mean all you need is a few magical tips from a writing God and you'll be pulling Nobel Prizes out your ass? Could happen, but good luck finding someone that good, and even if you find them, good luck convincing them you're worth a breath.

Either you let the people you write with change you, or you change them. Either way none of us will ever be the same, for better or worse. Whether these stories happened in some mystical land of magic and swords, or Neptune, they are still a part of you, your memory, and through that, your character. Your character is no more and no less than your best imaginary friend.

Taking part in the creation of something that some could even construe as fact, as history, reality, is not self-gratification, it's self-actualization. There is no greater pride than the pride you take in your creation, your victory over idleness. That doesn't debase it, or demoralize it. Would you rather be sitting in front of the TV, or working hard at that 9 to 5 so you can save up for that fly new ride and get yourself some ass? So what if you're likely to never meet or know any of the people you work with here? They're still real people, with real stories, and a real viewpoint. And as writers, which all of us love to call ourselves, we're colleagues; peers. Equals. Maybe even friends.

Here's to you, my friends.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ebivoulya

Here's to you, my friends.

---

Cheers!

Now post in our god-damned thread...

;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sighter Tnailog

I've just been noticing for some time now a trend on Althanas towards the idolization of the numbers over the writing. I run into people whose spirits are dashed when they don't get a Judge's Choice within three weeks of joining -- I was at level 6 before I got a Judge's Choice, regardless of Cyrus's opinions on my writing, which I take as a lovely compliment. Or I find people who are more concerned about getting onto the top ten EXP chart than on deserving of the honor.

---

Well there is a good reason why there hopes are dashed when not getting a judges choice. People’s first and maybe only experience with being critiqued on their writing is school and in school the JC range of 80-100 is quite easy to gain while in Althanas it’s really hard and for some, maybe impossible. To those who have won a JC the tilt isn’t as daunting but to some of us who find it hard to get a 60 or 50 it can really eat away at the spirits. But then again you find other members that don’t score your work but give you some appreciation. I think it might be better to have an option to keep the scores hidden and let the words speak for them selves because Althanas’ scoring system is too tilted to allow numbers to accurately represent the judge’s opinion.

People really want to stand out and get noticed and while you can do it through writing, it doesn’t feel as effective is writing a JC or getting a teaser that puts your work on the front page and goes look at this awesome member. And those that can’t got to the next best thing that they can control, EXP and Gold since you can get a lot and it’s a way to stand out. People want to be noticed here and these ways seem easiest.

I don't know about anybody else, but Althanas was expressly considered to be one of the top Rping sites next to Tal'Vorn and GWing (although after a visit to GWing, I have concluded that it is merely popularity that makes GWing so great, and not writing ability). I joined Althanas solely for the reason to improve my Rping and working together with other writers to create unforgettable story lines.

So I do have a certain fascination with the score giving and how fast I can cover levels, because if I'm moving slowly through levels and such, I'm obviously not writing very well. I use the experience and gold to gauge how well I am moving and improving.

The reason people might want to get things is that because we cannot just give our character's anything, we frantically quest trying to achieve the character that we originally dreamed up.

I know Yamihara, Abbie, Kai, and I think BatMoon know this, but Nenal basacally in his progression of events becomes a god like creature gifted with the powerful elements (gua style) Theta (which is death) and Omega (destruction). The dual bone blades are actually made from the bones of the Fafnir and have a lethal poison. To top it off Nenal is the brother, which I was planning to reveal in another quest, is the brother to the Saint Michael, and uncle to his son (a new character I just created on Gua) Arutha.

That's also failing to mention that Nenal dies twice and is reborn both times. First as a Shadow Angel which is my creation, and the race of my first and favorite character Striker, and then dies again and becomes an Angel of Death, an evil incarnate if you will, known as Yinyang, you can read a little bit about Yinyang in my story in Creative Endeavors, "Satan's Return," which focuses around Arutha.

So basacally Althanas is the prologue to Nenal's story, and in order to give the blades their abilities, I have to progress don't I? While I agree, it shouldn't be all about the gold, weapons, exp, and the other nonsense, but I want to progress my characters and by having them interact with other people, they are quickly becoming more and more what I dreamed him to be.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daggertail

Well there is a good reason why there hopes are dashed when not getting a judges choice. People’s first and maybe only experience with being critiqued on their writing is school and in school the JC range of 80-100 is quite easy to gain while in Althanas it’s really hard and for some, maybe impossible. To those who have won a JC the tilt isn’t as daunting but to some of us who find it hard to get a 60 or 50 it can really eat away at the spirits. But then again you find other members that don’t score your work but give you some appreciation. I think it might be better to have an option to keep the scores hidden and let the words speak for them selves because Althanas’ scoring system is too tilted to allow numbers to accurately represent the judge’s opinion.

People really want to stand out and get noticed and while you can do it through writing, it doesn’t feel as effective is writing a JC or getting a teaser that puts your work on the front page and goes look at this awesome member. And those that can’t got to the next best thing that they can control, EXP and Gold since you can get a lot and it’s a way to stand out. People want to be noticed here and these ways seem easiest.

---

I believe you're missing a bit of the point of what Madison is arguing. I don't think he'd disagree with you in that JCs, EXP, GP, etc. are seen as means to getting fame on the site. What Madison is instead suggesting is that is a warped priority, and that our primary goal of writing should be writing for its own sake. Unless you're F. Scott Fitzgerald, then you write to fuel your drinking habit.

In that regard, I don't disagree with Madison. Recently I've had a couple quests that scored in the very high 70s. Instead of taking it as "goddaminity crap, I get no JC love" I was happy because Dissinger (the judge in both cases) offered quite a few comments that said he liked my writing and the story in both cases. Also, in the quest that was a group quest with Letho, I feel we both had an enjoyable time.

If I had been so number centric, I would have given myself an anuerism. Instead, I was glad to get enough EXP to level and now go on to write more neat stories.

Shyam pretty much hit the nail on the head when it comes to clarification. But I would like to make one more.

It's not even so much that I feel we should be writing solely for writing's sake, in the absence of any thought given to JCs, EXP, GP, etc. My problem is more with the general sense I get sometimes about how some are writing only for those things. Writing for those things is fine, but there should always be some element of doing it because you can't not do it.

Shyam certainly hits that nail on the head a lot. Poor nail must have major head trauma by now. :P

I'm not going to write some big long thing, but I have felt all along that some people are here for writing experience and some are here for fun, but personally, I am here for both. Since joining Althanas my writing has improved, and I've had fun. If I really care about experience I wouldn't change characters every thread I do! Haha.

Anyways, I'm actually keeping characters recently but not because of experience, but because I want to complete their stories.

If you want stories, drop the canned tournaments, the stories behind them, and the forced battles. Drop the Thayne lore. Drop the powergroups. Drop the rest of the features. Drop the regions. Drop character registration. Start over. Make the entire board solo-writing. Force writers to do their own damned thing. Screw this fictional place we've worked so hard to set up.

Althanas isn't just a place for good stories. It's a place to compete. You want something raw, and straight from the gut, then read a zine or a English grad's manuscipt. The thing is, this is a place where people write in an environment they have SOME control over, but not all. There's a war every day. We've got ki-blasting-not-quite-dead-vampire-samurai. We've got fox-people. We've got soul-sucking-demonic-half-elves. That's what people write about. Really. That's what they like to write about. THEIR character, interacting with the fabricated world aroud it.

We've got more stories in our heads than we can possibly put on paper, or pound out on a keyboard. But frankly, half, if not most of them won't fly here, unless you're willing to retrofit the time/place/character to a fantasy world shared with happenings that simply don't fit with the gem you've got in your head. That, and time isn't exactly a resource any of us really have an abundance of. So, speaking for myself personally, if I'm going to submit something, it's going to be good. It's going to be worth a shake or two. It's going to be able to stand with the better writers here. It has little to do with my personal skill as a writer. I'm not all that great. It has to do with the drive to write a sentence that really hits home. The same kind of drive a baseball player feels to smack one out of the park. A skeptic might say that he's doing it for money. Sure. Baseball players have to feed their creatine habit somehow (;)). If he didn't want to compete, however, he wouldn't be playing ball against other players on the same field.

If he just wanted to play the game, he'd toss the ball up in the air, and smack it down a grassy field. If he just wanted to compete, he wouldn't necessarily be playing a game that he loves.

You really can't say that it's one or the other.

But who cares? I've never gotten a Judge's Choice in my entire Althanas career. I've beaten some of Althanas's best in battle threads. I don't really think any of you would be overjoyed to see me next to your name in a tournament matchup. I'm not being haughty, just stating a fact. Who really gives a damn? Judge's Choice only carries the worth you feed to it. It only means as much as you let it mean.

To me, well. It doesn't mean a damned thing. Don't let a shiny motherfucking title define your skill. Don't let a trophy be how you determine your worth. Trophies only last but a little while. Trophies are real nice, until they start getting dusty.

Do not take this as argueing, Ithy. I agree completely with everything you said, but I am not here to compete. I am here to co-exist with other writers and improve myself by writing with others. I understand that those who want to compete have a great way to do it here, thus the creation of tournaments and Power Group wars.

Althanas is not designed for one single thing and thus cannot have one single opinion about it. A hundred different people can be here for different goals and be entirely correct and using the forum to its entire potential and nobody would be intuitively wrong. That is the beauty of Althanas, along with its lovably diverse community, it has an incredibly diverse range of creativity on all fronts. The very concept of Althanas is creative.

I love this place.

That's not arguing dude. That's affirming my standpoint. :p I agree wholeheartedly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ithermoss

We've got more stories in our heads than we can possibly put on paper, or pound out on a keyboard. But frankly, half, if not most of them won't fly here, unless you're willing to retrofit the time/place/character to a fantasy world shared with happenings that simply don't fit with the gem you've got in your head.

---

I want like...guns, and tanks...and like...ships....and fighter jets! And...GUUUUUNS! and bombs11!11!!!1! and fooken MACHIIIIIINE GUNS! R U KREZY!!?!??? AND WTF IS NUKES!?!?!??!?!?!?!

What you said is true, and following that I just recommend putting them down in a word doc, saving them - and possibly upping them in the creative endeavors forum.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Molotov

I believe you're missing a bit of the point of what Madison is arguing. I don't think he'd disagree with you in that JCs, EXP, GP, etc. are seen as means to getting fame on the site. What Madison is instead suggesting is that is a warped priority, and that our primary goal of writing should be writing for its own sake. Unless you're F. Scott Fitzgerald, then you write to fuel your drinking habit.

In that regard, I don't disagree with Madison. Recently I've had a couple quests that scored in the very high 70s. Instead of taking it as "goddaminity crap, I get no JC love" I was happy because Dissinger (the judge in both cases) offered quite a few comments that said he liked my writing and the story in both cases. Also, in the quest that was a group quest with Letho, I feel we both had an enjoyable time.

If I had been so number centric, I would have given myself an anuerism. Instead, I was glad to get enough EXP to level and now go on to write more neat stories.

---

I don't think I'm missing the point at all, I know that they are warped priorities but I'm looking into the causes of the warped priority. I don't know if they can be fixed or not but I'm trying to look for reasons why people have a warped priority.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daggertail

I don't think I'm missing the point at all, I know that they are warped priorities but I'm looking into the causes of the warped priority. I don't know if they can be fixed or not but I'm trying to look for reasons why people have a warped priority.

---

I find it hard to believe that JCs, Tournaments, etc. aren't merely a function of popular demand. Your causal arrow is wrong.

I wouldn't say they're a function of popular demand in itself, especially not in light of administrative power trips, and the notion that althanas has its popular demand more or less decided for it. Not saying that's so wrong, mind you. I'm saying it simply is.

My reasons for being on Althanas has always been to simply get writing done. I pesonally have always tried to make my work better as I've progressed as a writer and I feel that the system of experience and levels is simply a way to gauge your current standing against every other writer on Althanas. Me personally, I think the scoring system works well because you work to try and achieve higher scores.

I like to think that as I hit a plateau of writing with the judges then I know that I've obtained a certain level of skill if I'm constantly getting scores of at least 75 on average. Me personally, when I do my Solo Quest work, or any other epical project--I'm AIMING to try and recieve a JC. I think that there's a certain feeling of accomplishment with the Althanas judging system as rigorous as it is nowadays when anybody can net a JC.

With that in mind that's why I make it a point to try and net JC's. Not for anytype of experience or gold reward (Or even the fact that is often easier to get Spoils requests on higher Scores, especially JC's) but because as a writer I am an over achiever. You ask anybody who has ever worked with me on a project and they will tell you that I take writing extremely seriously.

My love of writing is why I am pursuing a career as a graphic novel creator. I think that there's something really awesome about being able to fuze art skills together with writing skills into a unique product that everybody will love.

Those are just my personal views on it. I am here to write, I am here to be THE BEST I POSSIBLY CAN BE. I see the Judge's Choice as a standard to work for. I see tournaments as a chance to compete (As Ithy so eloquently put it) against other skilled writers.

Those are just my two cents on the matter. You can't complete a story if you don't at least TRY to write it down to begin with. Having an idea of how to write the story in a structured way helps every writer to become a better writer. (As they view themselves and in conformity to site rules)

I would only further add that in the case of tournaments I would even suggest that you don't look at it as a way of gaining fame.

But rather as a way of combining storylines and combining histories in a plot mechanic that makes the story very exciting, adds tension, and adds a sense of unpredictability. (When it comes to how winners are chosen, the whole random element based upon the Judge's own inclinations) Anyway these are just my own views.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ithermoss

I wouldn't say they're a function of popular demand in itself, especially not in light of administrative power trips, and the notion that althanas has its popular demand more or less decided for it. Not saying that's so wrong, mind you. I'm saying it simply is.

---

If Althanas' popular demand was decided for it, the Thayne wouldn't have caught on -- remember how long it took me to come around to the idea?

If popular demand was decided for Althanas, we'd still be playing where the storyline winner gets the EXP, not the score winner.

If popular demand was decided for Althanas, I wouldn't get PMs every day asking about when the next AC is coming. I was ready to abandon the thing, but there seems to be a wellspring of support.

I think saying that "what's cool" on Althanas and "who's hot" on Althanas is the result of a power tripping administration is really not true, and I'm not even sure what you mean by a "power tripping administration." Can you clarify that?

Madison The Thayne is just ONE of Althanas' many religions as Ithy has stated so many times its only ONE way of looking at Althanas. It is not THE way of looking at Althanas. Every region has its own Gods and Deities the Thayne is just one of many religions around. Who is to say that some other dedicated player like you or myself can't come up with a viable alternative to the Thayne?

Um...you don't need to defend the Thayne with me. I like the Thayne and think it contributes great things to Althanas. But when the Thayne was first created I didn't like them, and if my memory serves they were created when I was an administrator. My administrative powers did not in any way, however, effect the Thayne's ability to catch on and contribute to Althanas.

My argument is that the direction given to the site by the administrators does not always, indeed, it rarely does, shape the popular consciousness on Althanas. Player activity and ideas do that far better than any edicts ever will.

I'll post a longer reply later, but in short Madison is dead-on: we'll offer up whatever tournaments/events that you guys want to see and would want to post-in. The last Cell tournament was an example of this, and right now I've heard a lot of people wanting to do Gisela and the AC, which pretty much guarantees that those two will be run again in the near future.

I didn't suggest that popular demand has nothing at all to do with it, no. It definitely has its place. I believe the first AC that was run was more or less, a flop (thus, the EXP penalties). Had it not been for the interest to "do it better" the second time around, I doubt it'd be around today.

I'm being negative for negativity's sake, or anything like it. I'm suggesting that the AC wouldn't have existed had it not been for you getting it in your head to start it up. Since you had the power of execution, so long as you got Max to agree (if he did at all, originally, I don't remember), you put it into practice. It takes initiative for popular demand to actually catch on, imho. It just so happens that the events that really "catch on" are largely staff operated. There have been player-run events before like Iron Giants, Wolftrappe's Zombie Thing, and even the Acolyte Wars back a year or so ago.

I'm going to speak about what I really know here, and that's the Acolyte Wars. I thought of it, and put it into play. It was quite popular. The people who played were quite eager to start the next round. It was far too much work for one person, and nobody was willing to pick up some of the slack. It was an awesome idea, and a revolutionary twist in the way Gisela-type battles are run. The problem was lack of support. There's no blame here, or anything of the sort. I'm simply saying that the staff of the website has a huge impact on what becomes popular, in their support of official features. I'm suggesting that not voting in favor of something is a vote against it, regardless if you vote at all.

And this isn't the correct forum to discuss your latter question. There are names that needn't be named. I would think that you would have some idea of what I'm talking about, Madison.